Rethinking the Draft: Ideas for the Next MLB Collective Bargaining Agreement
As you know, the MLB owners and players are currently negotiating a new Collective Bargaining Agreement. Everything is under wraps at this point, but there are no hints about serious labor strife, which is quite refreshing considering what has happened in the past, and what has gone on recently in the less important sports. Changes in the draft are expected, although the alterations may be less radical than originally projected. The whole notion of a "world draft" for example, which is frequently proposed, may be unworkable.
In his most recent Baseball America "Ask" column, Jim Callis put forward some ideas about how he would change the shape of free agent compensation. Personally, I agree with Jim that the statistical rating system for free agents needs to be totally reworked, certainly using more advanced sabermetric ideas would help a lot. I disagree that compensation for "Type B" free agents should be eliminated, but I think it can be toned down, say making them worth supplemental second round picks instead of first. I am opposed to the concept of an international draft.
What do you guys think? If you were benevolent dictator and could rework the draft as you see fit in the CBA, how would you do so? Ground rules: you can't eliminate the draft, and keep in mind that your proposal is something that the union needs to go along with. You're dictator, but more in the relatively benevolent, conciliatory Napoleon III style than the original Napoleon.
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Reworked Draft
should include a provision to disallow the perrenial big spenders from “outbidding” teams on players, thus creating defacto open bidding. The usual suspects (Yankees, Redsox, Detroit, etc) should not circumvent the spirit of the fundamental reason for the draft to beign with: allowing the bottom teams to imrove by having access to the better prospects. If the big-money teams can spend way over-budget for elite prospects, the draft just doesn’t work the way it was intended.
by Hairylady on Oct 27, 2025 9:21 AM EDT reply actions
Except that it's not generally the big money teams that have been the heavy spenders of late
The Yankees haven’t really gone after a lot of signability guys, but the Nationals have. Mid-markets should have realized that spending money on draft picks, over time, is a more effective way of putting together a team than throwing money at free agents a la Boston, New York (both teams), the Cubs and Tigers. In some ways being able to go overslot for players has helped them compete with larger markets.
by d_c_guy on Oct 27, 2025 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
+1
For the most part, the teams that have been able to really exploit the current system in the past 6 years have been smaller-market, smaller-budget teams like Tampa, KC, Toronto, and Pittsburgh (more recently). Boston has also done a good job of getting highly-ranked guys that have fallen down the board.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
by Fla-Giant on Oct 27, 2025 7:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Good narrative.
Too bad the facts disagree.
by Lolmoarpl0x on Oct 27, 2025 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Except that
there wouldn’t be any “outbidding” because a player is selected by a team and can only negotiate with that team. The big money teams (Yanks, Red Sox, etc.) didn’t have a chance to outbid teams for Cole, Bundy, Bauer, or Rendon. Any team could have given Josh Bell $5M, but they all passed and the Pirates made it happen
by HarleyMila on Oct 27, 2025 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Hard to do
that without some sort of slotting, of course.
by Hairylady on Oct 27, 2025 9:22 AM EDT reply actions
budgeting
Rather than setting individual slots, why not set each team’s budget? If a team wants to over spend on a pick here or there, they can, but they’ll pay for it elsewhere.
Maybe it would be more palatable for the players union if the total draft budget is linked as a percentage of the total MLB player salaries of the previous year. If you want to be able to spend on the draft, spend on players.
by rlwhite on Oct 27, 2025 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions
I think you end up with creating too much parity between the big/medium/small markets.
Personally, I want a draft that favors the worst teams. (Assuming they have competent scouting dept) You want the bad team overspending the rest of the league on the draft instead of signing vets to play on a 100 loss team.
by FrancoTAU on Oct 27, 2025 9:49 PM EDT up reply actions
To add to Callis's ideas
They should rework the direct compensation as well. If a team signs three Type As (lose a 1st and 2nd and 3rd) yet loses two Type A s(gaining two 1sts), they currently end up with two first round picks, two supp firsts, and some poor team gets stuck with their 3rd rounder.
Instead, if a team gains a 2nd or 3rd first rounder, those should be eligible to be relinquished to teams whose FAs they signed.
Go Rice Owls!
Would be a Matt Harrison fan, but I only like superstars
by JBImaknee on Oct 27, 2025 9:24 AM EDT reply actions
this doesn't happen often but should be
incorporated into the system somehow.
by ThnkGoodnessforHowieRose on Oct 27, 2025 10:12 AM EDT up reply actions
I know the Yankees took advantage of that when they signed Sabathia, Texeira and Burnett the same offseason
The downside, of course, was that they had to keep A.J. Burnett …
by d_c_guy on Oct 27, 2025 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions
I agree that losing a B
and gaining a sandwich pick between rds 1 and 2 is probably an overcompensation. People are prone to saying that you don’t lose a pick by signing a type B, but that isn’t really accurate… you don’t forfeit a direct pick but you drop back a pick for every B that is signed (and obviously offered arbitration)… and that clearly affects the players available in the 2nd round and beyond. I like the idea of dropping the sandwich round after the 2nd rd.
by ThnkGoodnessforHowieRose on Oct 27, 2025 10:16 AM EDT reply actions
Josh Bell and Daniel Norris as an example
should have being first rounders, but fall due to bonus demands. That is not fair.
Toronto and tampa Bay getting picks for guys like Brad Hawpe and other bad relievers. Also the signing deadline must be earlier.
by LCT on Oct 27, 2025 10:28 AM EDT reply actions
I'm not sure
what isn’t fair about it. Negotiations are all about leverage. If players have options like going to college or returning to college than they have the ability to exert that leverage. No one seems to have an issue with teams when they exert their leverage.
by ThnkGoodnessforHowieRose on Oct 27, 2025 10:38 AM EDT up reply actions
Agreed
The only way to keep that from happening would be to implement the hard-slotting. I don’t like that as I think it doesn’t reward the players and the best GMs enough.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
by Fla-Giant on Oct 27, 2025 7:24 PM EDT up reply actions
1. rework comp system as noted to make it more fair. the elias rankings are ridiculous. type A free agent comp will stay the same, type B free agent comp will be 2nd round comp picks.
2. signing deadline moved to july 15. it’s in the best interest of everyone involved. the $$$ won’t change, the kids that sign will get a month or more to play, college coaches will get a little extra recruiting time after the draft.
i’m not really sure i’d change anything else.
R.I.P. cwhitman412, Frederick0220, & Mets2k9
http://twitter.com/doublestix
by doublestix on Oct 27, 2025 10:33 AM EDT reply actions 5 recs
Wrong on one count
I think the dollars will change a lot. The only reason anybody signs for slot is to play right away.
by ttnorm on Oct 27, 2025 5:11 PM EDT up reply actions
don't understand
right when it comes down to the deadline, the top guys are still gonna get 5 or 7 million or whatever. and the guys who sign right away will still sign for slot.
R.I.P. cwhitman412, Frederick0220, & Mets2k9
http://twitter.com/doublestix
by doublestix on Oct 27, 2025 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Why would guys sign for slot
if the league removes the disincentive of not playing for the summer?
by ttnorm on Oct 27, 2025 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions
almost nobody signs right away. Bauer was the exception
besides, you would still get an extra 5 weeks if July 15 is the new date.
by dooblay on Oct 28, 2025 4:18 AM EDT up reply actions
Guys who sign for slot almost always sign early enough to play
That is the leverage that the owners have - you lose some development time by waiting which could delay your arrival at the show which starts the FA clock. Almost everybody who signs at slot mentions that they did not want to delay their development.
by ttnorm on Oct 28, 2025 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions
Those players,
like Christian Colon and Billy Butler (Home team examples) who signed within days, were going to sign immediatly regardless of when the deadline is set. Its a mentality adopted way before the draft. I dont see how moving it up causes the players to change their thinking.
Those guys told their agents, “I dont want to dick around, I want to play ball. If they offer me 85% of what I might get by holding out, take it.”…It would have been smart if Starling had taken this route. He would have had 150+ rookie league ABs under his belt, and gone into ’12 ST with confidence and ready for fullseason A Ball.
Instead he sat on the couch all summer, went to instructional ball, got cited for underage boozing and was shut down early with a quad injury. Not too late at all, but a bad start to his pro career. Might cost him a full year in the long run. Just IMO.
by dooblay on Oct 28, 2025 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Side Note,
It has been reported in the KC Star, that Starling was offered 7.5 mil immediatly after the draft and told that was their best offer. Boras tried playing the Neb football card but to KCs credit, they didnt bite. They knew he wanted to play ball, and were willing to take the 6th pick in a deep ’12 class if he didnt.
I use this example, because i think moving the deadline up is one of the most important issues that need addressing. Its just such a waste of time.
Both sides reported that after the initial meeting (offer) following the draft, their was no contact at all from either side until the day before the deadline.
A ridiculous game of chicken and a complete waste of everyone’s (frustrated fans included) time.
by dooblay on Oct 28, 2025 8:56 PM EDT up reply actions
+1
R.I.P. cwhitman412, Frederick0220, & Mets2k9
http://twitter.com/doublestix
by doublestix on Oct 30, 2025 7:40 PM EDT up reply actions
+3
Agree on all of that except I would also reduce draft to 25 rounds instead of 50 so that you could open up free agency to more youngsters so they can sign with whoever they want to. And before someone says they’ll all go to the Yankees, most kids want to stay close to home and be near family so it would be more likely that a kid who grew up near Arizona would sign with the Diamondbacks before signing with the Yankees. The other major sports had done this with their drafts (NBA from 7 to 2, NFL from 12 to 7, etc,) and it has only made the market better.
by rblythepittsteel on Nov 16, 2025 12:23 PM EST up reply actions
Elite prospects
often sign after the first two or even three rounds when clubs avoid drafting them out of exorbitant money concerns. The same thing would/might happen. Teams picking in later rounds would still be allowed to draft elite, hig-priced picks in Rd #4 or Rd #5 for outrageous amounts. Under the present sytem or the ones being proposed above, these deals canstill be worked out in advance and the powerful clubs will end up with the elite prospects. The best idea so far is limiting the overall signing budget for all teams, but that isn’t likely to fly with the player’s union.
by Hairylady on Oct 27, 2025 10:56 AM EDT reply actions
Name an elite prospect who signed in 3rd or 4th round or later
Somebody correct me if I am wrong but I really don’t recall any “elite prospects” having done this recently. There are occasional borderline 1st round or 2nd round talents that drop to the middle rounds.
But these guys are not elite. The truly elite prospects are still taken in the first round 90% of the time even when signability is a problem. Because if teams swing and miss on them they still get another first rounder next year so they can afford to swing for the fences.
Even in a case like Josh Bell where he slipped to the 2nd round, he was still the first pick of the 2nd round and still signed with the Bucs. So I don’t even see how that could be used as a sign that the draft is broken because the system still worked as the worst team ended up with multiple elite prospects.
by Chewy59 on Oct 27, 2025 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions
AJ Cole and Wil Myers
Both were definite 1st round talents that fell due to signability concerns.
by another know it all on Oct 27, 2025 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions
you're not allowed to use those guys
I mean geez, they completely dismantle his argument! That’s not fair!
by mrkupe on Oct 27, 2025 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions
sorry
i meant Matt Purke…. no….. Tim Melville. Yeah, Tim Melville
every draft has a 1st round talent that falls out of the first 3 rounds.
by another know it all on Oct 27, 2025 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions
I allowed in my post for the fact that some first or second rounders drop the middle rounds for signability issues.
I guess what we have here is a difference in how we are defining “elite.” To me the elite prospects are the guys who are Top 10 caliber picks.
After that I really don’t include someone as an elite prospect. Maybe I am defining it too narrowly.
I will admit this as well, in following this years draft I was mainly paying attention to the Phillies and their picks. So I am not completely, 100% informed on Purke, Cole, Melville and Myers draft stocks.
I know they were first round talents, I don’t believe they were Top 10 talents but I suppose its possible they could have been and I just missed it.
by Chewy59 on Oct 27, 2025 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions
a top 10 talent to one team
might not be a top 100 talent to another team. This isn’t the NFL where there may only be 5-6 elite players available. This year’s draft had probably 50-60 elite prospects. Some years have only 15-20. “Top 10” seems arbitrary.
Injury concerns and signability are the only reasons a player will fall in the draft, so I’m not sure what you’re even getting at.
The draft is broken because it’s award system for picks is way out of whack. A few elite guys will fall in every draft regardless of how many comp picks there are, so I’m not even sure how any of this is relevant.
by another know it all on Oct 27, 2025 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions
pretty smart
for another know it all… ;-)
by ThnkGoodnessforHowieRose on Oct 27, 2025 2:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Right so I guess this is where the disagreement stems from here. I just cannot accept that there are 60 elite prospects in one draft. At some point its just watering down the term elite.
Its like in the NFL, John Clayton lists something like 13 out of the league’s 32 Starting QB’s as elite every year. Its ridiculous. Elite is the best of the best, not 40% the league.
You are right though, top 10 was arbitrary cutoff I made on the spot. Doesn’t necessarily mean there is exactly 10 elite prospects every year. I was trying to give a sense of how exclusively I view the term elite to mean.
There were probably more than 10 elite prospects but you just simply cannot convince me that there were any more than 20 tops, let alone 60. Call it a difference in opinion if you want.
by Chewy59 on Oct 27, 2025 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I asked to be corrected if I am wrong… so its a bit disingenuous to make a post like this suggesting I am not open to discussion
by Chewy59 on Oct 27, 2025 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions
Who are the teams that spent the most money in the '11 draft?
If I remember correctly, it was Pitt, Tor, Wash, KC, TB and Bos. That mostly makes your theory irrelevant. I am a huge KC fan, and we have landed some great over slot prospects since Moore took over, ( Wil Myers, Chris Dwyer, Louis Coleman, etc) and I definitely do NOT want that changed. This year we paid overslot on 7 or 8 picks I think. We wouldnt have had the #1 system in baseball last yr without doing that.
by dooblay on Oct 28, 2025 4:26 AM EDT up reply actions
The Most Sensible Approach
would be to funnel the ridiculous money that is lavished on prospects back into MLB player’s salary $$$. That would more likely satisfy the MLB Players Union. Better to give the $$$ to proven players than to slop it around on hopefuls.
by Hairylady on Oct 27, 2025 11:05 AM EDT reply actions
Its pretty much been show time and time again that investing in the draft is a better use of money that on free agents. Yes some prospects will fail, so do some proven players when signed (e.g. John Lackey).
But in the end, if you invest in the draft every year (this includes investing in scouting) then the tiny amounts of money actually being spent on the players in the draft (relative to MLB talent signings) will be huge bargains for the club. Getting 6 years of club control of these players easily is the best bet.
Furthermore, if you are a contending team you can deal these prospects for proven players.
by Chewy59 on Oct 27, 2025 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions
As ridiculous as guaranteeing Adam Dunn 56 mil?
Um, no
by dooblay on Oct 28, 2025 9:46 PM EDT up reply actions
That is a ridiculous idea and woud crush
small markets.
by dooblay on Oct 28, 2025 4:33 AM EDT up reply actions
That Would Mean
teams having a “floor” the had to spend each year on salaries, instead of banking all the money.
by Hairylady on Oct 27, 2025 11:07 AM EDT reply actions
They Already Do
Teams have to spend at least the league minimum x 25. Functionally, they need to spend something more than that to seem “competitive.” Witness the pressure MLB placed on the Marlins a while back. It led to Josh Johnson’s extension.
by GuyinNY on Oct 27, 2025 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions
I just have to say I love the Napoleon III analogy. Its not every day people reference the Second French Empire.
by Chewy59 on Oct 27, 2025 11:07 AM EDT reply actions
The biggest thing I’d look to change is the compensation. Elias needs to rework their rankings. Definitely agree with John that more sabermetric principles should be applied there.
I suppose a supplemental for Type B is a bit high also. I wouldn’t mind that being bumped back to 3rd rounder.
In addition, I think the point made above about teams who just sign a bunch of Type A free agents in one season so that the other team only ends up gaining 2nd and 3rd rounders is a valid concern. It really stinks that you lose a star player and instead of getting normal compensation you get a 3rd rounder.
I’d say one of three things need to be administered here. You could pass a rule saying the teams highest draft pick always goes. So if they lose a Type A free agent and then sign 3 others. Rather than gaining a 1st and Supplemental, they have to include those in the compensation packages to those other teams.
Second option would be to give the club an option. Do you want to take back a 3rd rounder this year in return for losing your Type A or would you rather wait and take a 1st rounder next year?
Finally, a last option is to still penalize the signing team with their draft picks in the same manor. However, the team that loses a Type A player and should be getting a 1st rounder but is instead getting a 2nd or 3rd rounder will instead take their draft pick in the supplemental. So in essence they end up with 2 supplemental picks. But the signing team still loses their draft pick as they would now.
by Chewy59 on Oct 27, 2025 11:23 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Take the leverage away
The team owns the rights to the player selected for 5 years, whether he signs in the draft or not. Go to college or not, you lose your bargaining power because the team that drafted you, still gets you. Hard slotting value is now real, because there is no incentive to not sign, hoping a different team will draft you next year.
This will stop the top players from sliding, for outrageous signing demands, hoping to slide to an elite team.
I was the first to get Blez autograph. Nebraska native, South Dakota living A's fan
by HuskerFan on Oct 27, 2025 11:29 AM EDT reply actions
If needed
Limit the ownership rights to the top 5 rounds, so later rounds aren’t used to steal future 1st rounders
I was the first to get Blez autograph. Nebraska native, South Dakota living A's fan
by HuskerFan on Oct 27, 2025 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions
Or, make it 3 years of control
A HS player wants to go to college? Fine, but then he’s staying for four years or going to the team that selected him out of HS. I’d probably put some sort of cap on the # of unsigned players a team could designate that way, but it would be interesting to think about that concept further.
And absolutely, Callis’s ideas of reworking Elias ratings so that Type A and Type B players actually, you know, are valuable and netting out the number of comp picks based on subtracting Type A/B signings from departures are no-brainer inclusions.
by realitypolice on Oct 27, 2025 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions
I can't see that one holding up in court
The team gets to arbitrarily decide that some players (none of whom have actually signed a contract with the team) aren’t allowed to negotiate with anybody else?
by mrkupe on Oct 27, 2025 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Like they do now in the draft? Or they did before under draft-and-follow rules?
by rlwhite on Oct 27, 2025 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions
His point's valid
in regards to my suggestion of “cap on the # of unsigned players a team coud designate.” Both the current system and the old draft-and-follow rules were universal…
I do think Husker’s original idea of a team controlling a player even if they don’t come to terms merits consideration, but Kupe’s almost certainly right that it would need to be an across-the-board policy. If MLB wants to drive down large signing bonuses, and can’t get some of their idiot owners to stop bidding against themselves in discussions with high school players, this would help accomplish the goal. If you go this way though, I think it should only cover through the draft following a player’s junior year.
by realitypolice on Oct 27, 2025 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Reminds me a little bit of how the Celts got Larry Bird
They drafted him, but couldnt sign him. He went back to school, and they signed him the following year before he reentered the draft.
by dooblay on Oct 28, 2025 4:43 AM EDT up reply actions
my point is
Even draft and follows had the option of declining to sign and re-entering the draft to be selected by another team while retaining leverage. Your system completely destroys the leverage that these players have and makes what is already an extremely difficult decision for teenagers that much harder.
Also, what about players who go to a community college? These are two year academic programs and they’re draft-eligible while they’re there. Do you really want a system that encourages kids who aren’t ready to go pro for one reason or another to pass up the 4 year college game? You can’t lock kids in a 2 year school into a 4 year restriction.
by mrkupe on Oct 27, 2025 6:32 PM EDT up reply actions
2 Things
The Elias Rankings especially for relievers need to be redone. They are costing relievers a lot of money in free agency. I would like the idea that you can trade draft picks.
VEB Proxy
by FlimtotheFlam on Oct 27, 2025 11:42 AM EDT reply actions
I think trading draft picks would be an awful idea
“Suddenly”, every top talent puts out word that he won’t sign unless traded to the Yankees, Red Sox, Cubs, or Rangers (competent management +lots of the kids growing up in the area + no state income tax). I might be missing a team or two there, but that’s the gist of what would happen.
by mrkupe on Oct 27, 2025 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions
i dont think this would be a huge issue
this would be the same issue as players that WON’T sign if drafted (Josh Bell) or float huge bonus demands and still go high (Bradley, Bundy, most top picks). I think teams would just call their bluff, take them and offer the money it takes to get them signed. In the other sports where picks can be traded this is extremely rare. In football the only people I can think of that did this was Elway, Eli Manning who both went number 1 overall, and rumors about Andrew Luck doing it this year, the clear cut number 1 overall pick.
by THESWAMI6 on Oct 27, 2025 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Its an apples to oranges comparison.
There is a difference. Often times being on the worst teams means there is an opening for you to play right away in football. Especially as a top draft choice.
In baseball you are likely to spend several years in the minor league system. Elite teams can afford to take you on and develop you in the minor leagues. There is no problem of hindering your development by having you ride the pine or immediately forcing out an established player to make room for you.
by Chewy59 on Oct 27, 2025 12:32 PM EDT up reply actions
football is a different story
1) Competitive and economic parity in football makes players less inclined to favor one situation over another
2) Football players have a very limited shelf life, and in general they come from much more disadvantaged backgrounds than baseball players - in other words, there is much greater incentive for them to sign sooner rather than later.
3) High caliber football prospects still see much more money than baseball draftees. Even with the new slot rookie deals, they’re still seeing a LOT more money than your average “really good baseball prospect”.
by mrkupe on Oct 27, 2025 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Backgrounds
Is that true? I’m not aware of any studies like that.
by Matt0330 on Oct 27, 2025 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions
4)
Baseball teams don’t draft for need like they do in football, hence their need to manipulate the draft order for guys they want.
There is no reason to start trading picks. I would like to think that some things can remain pure and simple.
by another know it all on Oct 27, 2025 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions
advantages
I think it would generate interest in the draft and prospects alike among more casual fans as well as give better front offices a competitive advantage, which I don’t think is a bad thing. This got me thinking though, i think a cool idea for an article would be to look at players that turned down big money offers, either outta highschool and went to college, or players that turned down offers and re-entered the draft the next year and see how they fared with their eventual signing bonus, compared to what they were originally offered and declined.
by THESWAMI6 on Oct 27, 2025 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Like how complaining has started
when nothing happened at all
by Lolmoarpl0x on Oct 27, 2025 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions
If that was the case, why wouldnt they now just say,
‘I wont sign with any team that drafts me except the yankees, so and so’. That wouldnt happen. Your conspiracy theory is overrated.
by dooblay on Oct 28, 2025 4:48 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Groups of players would go both directions on that I think
The top prospects (top 15 maybe) might be able to do that, but two things jump out:
1) The team still has to make a decision about whether to draft a player. Just because a prospect informs the league he won’t sign with any other team, actually gives the team leverage if they draft him. They could very easily draft him later and make a take-it-or-leave-it offer.
2) It seems like if I wasn’t a top 15 type prospect, it would be potentially to my benefit to be drafted by a team where I could move quickly and get to the majors fast. Someone like Ryan Zimmerman comes to mind. (I know he was drafted 4th overall, but he was someone who signed quickly and was in the Majors before the end of the season)
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by Jason Hunt on Oct 28, 2025 5:29 PM EDT via iPhone app up reply actions
No need for overhaul imo
The MLB Draft is the most unique and fun draft of all the major sports imho. I have never really had a problem with Boston or Toronto or whoever loading up on signability guys, because there are many examples of guys who sign for slot or even below slot who turn out to be very good major leaguers. Saw the average spending over the last 3 years per team in the draft over at BA, and the Phillies, Braves, and Cardinals were all well in the 20s in team spending. However, I would love to have any of their 3 systems right now, so really if you can scout and develop, you don’t have to spend insane at all to have an effective farm, even with some of the players asking for crazy money and ending up in Boston, etc. Do agree with John on toning down Type B’s to supp 2nd rd’ers and yes, would love to be able to trade draft picks as well.
by cardsman99 on Oct 27, 2025 11:54 AM EDT reply actions
I agree
In the past 2-3 years my opinion of the draft has done an 180. I used to be in favor or a Worldwide Draft with hard slotting.
Now, as I’ve learned more and more about the draft and the minor league system, I think the system works. It rewards teams that scout well. Its not in a position where its too expensive for small market teams. For small markets the best bang for their buck still is investing in the draft.
I like that teams can take chances on signability players in middle or later rounds. Personally I’d prefer not to trade draft picks and keep the system as it is now with some tweaks but trading draft picks isn’t a deal breaker for me.
by Chewy59 on Oct 27, 2025 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions
I think some Type B's are worth 1/2 picks, and others worth 2/3 picks
So, naturally, I’d make additional groups. There is so much available data that helps to define value (for the love of all that is holy, sabr it up - nobody cares how many pitcher wins a guy had anymore), so why don’t we use that to correspond to a greater number of tiers of draft compensation? I do like the overall system not because it balances power, but because it makes tactical maneuvering on the part of executives and front offices all the more important.
Don’t mess with the draft. There’s no way to improve it. International draft would be impossible, and hard slotting would push talent to other sports that provide more immediate financial returns than a sport that requires three or four years of minor-league slumming to reach the $400,000 payday… if you’re lucky enough to make it there in the first place.
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by Dan Strittmatter on Oct 27, 2025 12:37 PM EDT reply actions
my 2 cents
1. No international draft. In fact I would move Puerto Rico to the “international” category.
2. Signing deadline = draft day + 30 days
3. Current FA system is FUBAR. A couple half-steps:
a) a team gets compensation only if the player was on their roster for more than 1 full season.
b) 3-tier system-
Type A = top 10%, low 1st / high 2nd (as now)
Type B = next 15%, low 2nd / high 3rd
Type C = next 25%, low 3rd / high 4th
no sandwich picks
by Willie on Oct 27, 2025 1:27 PM EDT reply actions
Yes, but Puerto Rico is part of the U.S.
by cookiedabookie on Oct 27, 2025 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Sorry if this is off topic...
but another item that I think needs to be brought up in the CBA discussions is expansion of roster size. With practically every team carrying 12 pitchers most of the time, and sometimes 13, there is very little room for bench hitters (1 of which will always be the backup C), particularly in the AL where 9 hitters are in the lineup. Clubs used to carry only 10 pitchers, sometimes 9. I see this situation as only getting worse in the future (I think it’s only a matter of time before clubs start using 6-man rotations). I think the roster size needs to be expanded by at least 2 and I think this is way overdue. The players obviously would be in favor of this and the owners would not be. But this could be made part of some package deal where the owners could get some other change they want that the players are against.
In particular, this could be a way of getting rid of the DH, which the players are against but the owners might be for. I dont know how much sentiment there is against the DH, but to me it doesnt make sense for one league to have a rule that the other doesnt have. Either both leagues should adopt it or it should not be in either league (AL and NL are really conferences in the same league). To me, this is something else that should be discussed in the CBA discussions.
Maybe there can be a different thread for other CBA issues.
by rhd on Oct 27, 2025 4:01 PM EDT reply actions
been saying this for years.
25 is a nice number but it seems that the reality of today’s game has passed that concept by a while ago.
by ThnkGoodnessforHowieRose on Oct 27, 2025 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't see a reason to get rid of the DH, I think it's perfect as is
Creates a little variety between the leagues, generates a bit more offense (which teams generally love) in one league, and gives jobs to exciting hitters who can’t field.
If you tossed the DH, that slot is probably being taken up by a utility glove-only infielder or a left-handed specialist in the pen. Do you want more David Ortiz or more Will Ohman?
That said, adding a roster slot or two isn’t necessarily a bad idea. Maybe it could be provided with the restriction that the extra player must be making the minimum league salary.
by mrkupe on Oct 27, 2025 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions
why make that stipulation?
in spite of the motivation for it, you know that teams will end up adding additional arms though.
by ThnkGoodnessforHowieRose on Oct 27, 2025 6:42 PM EDT up reply actions
how do you designate one specific guy to be the 26th guy?
A team could theoretically say any one of the 26 was the ‘last’ guy. If you put a salary restriction on how much the ‘last’ guy could make, teams would never truthfully tell you which one would have been left off had it only been 25. Right?
by dooblay on Oct 28, 2025 5:04 AM EDT up reply actions
Adding roster spots would just make the game slower
Half of the teams would just add more relief pitchers, and the rest a mix of relief and bench players for double switches.
by cookiedabookie on Oct 27, 2025 8:16 PM EDT up reply actions
and the problem with that would be...?
by ThnkGoodnessforHowieRose on Oct 27, 2025 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, then you break up the amount
If your new amount is 27, then only 13 can be pitchers.
by dooblay on Oct 28, 2025 5:06 AM EDT up reply actions
Hard Slotting
I think the key to doing this right is to ensure that the slots aren’t absurdly low; I think what would be best is a “slot” system for the first round, and a “cap” system thereafter. The first round could be slotted from ~$6m down to $1m, and you could limit bonuses after the first round to $1m. This wouldn’t save the clubs that much money (especially after the 1st round), but I doubt we’d see that many more kids go to college or opt for another sport.
Another idea would be to allow teams to designate 5 players they can “draft & follow” through to January 31.
by gabrielsyme on Oct 27, 2025 5:15 PM EDT reply actions
Hard-slotting introduces a lot of bad, and unforeseen, consequences, IMO. For one thing, if you have hard-slotting you’re going to get way fewer high school prospects skipping college. I’d stay far away from it.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
by Fla-Giant on Oct 27, 2025 7:28 PM EDT up reply actions
I think the consequences are mostly foreseen
Some more kids go to college before entering professional ball. The occasional guy ends up playing football rather than baseball. Under my system, I doubt that there would be that many of either guys. At most 10 highschoolers going to college, and maybe one guy every couple of years who ends up playing football rather than baseball.
by gabrielsyme on Oct 27, 2025 8:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Forget Elias
How about the top 20% of free agent signings ($$$) get “A” comp picks. 21-40% get "B picks. Cutoff date is 7 days before draft.
by ttnorm on Oct 27, 2025 5:15 PM EDT reply actions
Draft Bonuses
I’m never sure why people seem to resent the bonuses that go to draftees, when they’re clearly so far below fair market value. You see when, for example, Cuban players arrive and they aren’t major league ready, they get far higher bonuses than they would if they went through the draft. Leonys Martin got $15 million, as a borderline B/B+ prospect. Chapman got $30 million (from memory).
Many of the prospects are young guys who have put their whole future on the line, and perhaps missed out on the education that they will need to do well in the world if they don’t make it as a ball player, but people get upset because a few of them get six or seven figure bonuses.
Also, the teams that would really be hurt by hard slotting wouldn’t be the Red Sox or the Yankees. They could just divert their money into more free agents, and more international signings. It would be the small market teams who recognise that putting time and money into scouting and drafting the best available players is their best chance, but who can’t compete for free agents.
by A Behemoth on Oct 27, 2025 5:38 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Draftees are cheap?!?
Why do you (and Callis always) say this? It is demonstrably an unreasonable statement. There was a study a while back about the draft and WAR expectations. Looking at the 1st six seasons of MLB service unter team control, The expected WAR of the #1 overall pick is only 10.9 and it goes down fast. The #10 pick is 3.3. The #20 pick is 2.3. The #30 pick is 1.9. After that we are not talking much difference between a supplemental pick and a replacement player. These guys are all major crap shoots and not at all undervalued.
by ttnorm on Oct 27, 2025 7:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes, cheap
One win on the FA market costs teams something like $5M, which means a 10.9 WAR guy out of the first pick in the draft is worth about $54M.
Meanwhile, the Pirates control the first three years of Gerritt Cole’s major league career for $15M and will get him at arbitration discounts for the following three years — and if he’s really “only” a 10.9 WAR player over his controlled period, those arb payments will be lucky to total another $15M.
So that’s $54M worth of expected performance for about $30M worth of expected cost. Sounds cheap to me…
by ManConley on Oct 27, 2025 8:24 PM EDT up reply actions
Not cheap
If he beats the odds and is truly a 10.9 WAR he is going to arb at much much higher than 3 YRS/$15. A guy like Garza (less that 3WAR in 2011) should get $8-9M in 2012 or more if they buy out some FA seasons.
by ttnorm on Oct 27, 2025 9:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Cole
Suppose he turns out to be a 10.9WAR player over 6 years - that comes out at about 2WAR/year, assuming a slightly slower start. If the Pirates have control over his first three years for $15 mill, including a large signing bonus, there is no way a 2WAR player gets close to 3/$40 in arbitration. He might get that or more if he turns into an ace, but then the Pirates would still be getting a bargain.
by A Behemoth on Oct 28, 2025 5:10 AM EDT up reply actions
I do not disagree with this
But it is not “Clearly so far below market value”. And that is the best case scenario - the #1 overall. THe value goes down fast after that. The #5 overall is 4.7WAR. The #12 overall is 3WAR. There is no way that Starling and Jungmann are great values using the same analysis. It gets worse the farther down you go.
by ttnorm on Oct 28, 2025 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions
OK, then...
Why is it that whenever someone ends up on the open market as a free agent instead of going into the draft they get much more than they would if they were drafted?
Did your study say how much on average the teams paid for the 10.9 WAR they got from the first pick and so on? If it did, then it’s pretty easy to work out whether draftees are cheap or not. I believe that the approximate value/cost of 1WAR is about $5million - willing to be corrected on this, but BP and others work this out every so often. On that basis, if the total cost of the number 1 pick in the 6 years of team control is less than c$55 million then having the number 1 pick is a bargain.
by A Behemoth on Oct 27, 2025 7:33 PM EDT reply actions
Sorry
This was meant to be a reply to ttnorm. Using the internet can be hard.
by A Behemoth on Oct 27, 2025 7:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Dollar value / WAR is tricky
The studies I have seen talk about calculating $$$ based on how many wins a player adds, and how many wins the team has. It is not as linear as 1WAR = $5M. Also, WAR values are up about 100% over the last 9 seasons so calculating an average over many seasons and comparing it to the current WAR valuations is kind of pointless.
But more to the point, this comp does not include the players salary over his minor league and 1st 6 seasons of his major league career. So even if 1WAR = $5M, there is no way to justify the statement that #1 overall getting an $8M bonus up front is “clearly so far below fair market value”.
A better comp is how much should you pay a guy who is expected to return less than 2WAR (pick # 28 and beyond) over the 6 seasons under team control. If you plan to spend 7 figures on that guy and think that is the value way to build a winner, I can not agree.
by ttnorm on Oct 27, 2025 8:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Later picks
I don’t think anyone is suggesting throwing millions at people who fall to late in the first or further, unless it’s due to signability - ie the talent is more like those of the earlier picks with higher expected WAR. For example, Josh Bell is likely to be significantly more talented than the average first pick in the second round, so paying him more is not unreasonable, although I think the Pirates may have overpaid somewhat.
by A Behemoth on Oct 28, 2025 5:05 AM EDT up reply actions
what I would do
Being more specific about what I would do, in case it wasn’t clear.
1) No hard slotting. Even the soft-slotting is pretty stupid if you ask me
2) No international draft. Impossible to administer.
3) No trading of draft picks. I have never liked the idea and it seems like something that will get abused.
4) Completely rework the free agent compensation formula using modern sabermetric ideas
5) Keep Type A free agent compensation as-is, but revise the formulas so that there are fewer Type A free agents.
6) Type B free agent compensation will be reduced, if you lose a Type B free agent you get a pick in the supplemental second round. The signing team loses nothing.
by John Sickels on Oct 27, 2025 7:36 PM EDT reply actions
Good stuff
This is very close to my views. See my post a few comments down for how I would refine the compensation rules.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
by Fla-Giant on Oct 27, 2025 8:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Regarding (5)
I think sandwich-round picks should be available for Type-A compensation. In other words, you get the first available pick from Team X outside of the top 15. As it is now, it’s a little ridiculous that type A comp can be the 20th pick, or the 100th.
by gabrielsyme on Oct 27, 2025 8:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Similar to mine
I would add:
If team signs multiple type A’s, give second (and beyond) teams losing players two supplementals.
Remove age restrictions in draft. Players should be allowed to be drafted every year, not have to wait for 1, 2, 3 years.
by cookiedabookie on Oct 27, 2025 8:20 PM EDT up reply actions
$$
I am not that concerned with reducing amateur bonuses. I AM concerned with competitive balance, and I think the current system where big-market teams tend to pick up a lot of extra compensation picks for rent-a-players needs to be adjusted.
by John Sickels on Oct 27, 2025 7:37 PM EDT reply actions
Its not so much big market teams
As intelligent GMs gaming the system. How many picks did Tampa have in the first two rounds last year?
Are there any teams that genuinely can’t afford to get a good draft class every year? I mean obviously if you are Tampa and have 12 top 100 picks or whatever, you’re going to have to take some more signable options, but most teams that don’t spend on the draft have made a decision not to. The White Sox, for example, can afford to sign Adam Dunn, but skimp on the draft every year. The fact that their farm is weak doesn’t indicate that there is a problem with the system - rather that they should redirect some resources here.
by A Behemoth on Oct 27, 2025 7:45 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah
Yeah that is more what I meant. I had the Red Sox in mind specifically, but “intelligent GMs gaming the system” is more accurate
by John Sickels on Oct 27, 2025 8:04 PM EDT up reply actions
but "gaming the system"
is another way of saying that you have a smart GM. Whatever the system is, the smarter GMs will figure out how to exploit it to their advantage.
by ThnkGoodnessforHowieRose on Oct 27, 2025 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions
True
But you might want to do something about the system if it isn’t achieving its objectives. For example, if compensation picks are intended to compensate teams for losing elite talent, and teams are getting a load of picks from stockpiling somewhat above average relievers, that is both smart GMing, and something that probably should be changed.
by A Behemoth on Oct 28, 2025 5:07 AM EDT up reply actions
there will always be
market inefficiencies to exploit in any system. in the case you’re describing, it’s only possible to gain those extra picks because:
1) some of these RPs are overvalued according to the current rating system, and
2) the players are turning down arbitration offers (if they are made in earnest and not some pre-arranged deal) b/c they think or know there will be some multi-year offers out there. and usually there is some dopey team willing to overpay these RPs. If there weren’t multi-yr offers waiting for these players then they wouldn’t turn down the Arb offers.
It actually shows that the system and market work pretty well. Moreover, don’t forget that many of these type B RPs earn a pretty good salary so the teams who benefit by getting sandwich picks from these types are also paying for it handsomely in salary.
One of the ways that the system gets circumvented I mentioned above is when there are these handshake deals to turn down or not even to offer arbitration. otoh, in a free market system, everything is open to negotiation, even that.
by ThnkGoodnessforHowieRose on Oct 28, 2025 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions
I agree that the Elias formula needs to be refined. However, I don’t agree that Type B comp picks should be relegated until after the 2nd round (or later). Here’s the changes I would make:
1. The bottom 15 teams (by won-loss record) get Type B compensation in the 1-S round.
2. The top 15 teams get B compensation after the 2-S round.
3. Type A compensation would be the same as now, except the 2nd comp pick would come in the 2-S round instead of after the 1-S round (as it is now). In other words teams would get the other teams 1st round pick (or 2nd round, or 3rd round, …) plus a supplemental comp pick after the 2nd round.
4. Only the bottom 12 teams (instead of the bottom 15 teams as it is now) would have their first round picks protected with respect to Type A free agents.
5. If a team drafts a guy in the first 3 rounds and refuses to enter good-faith contract negotiations with him due to something that was discovered in the draftees’ post-draft medical exam then the drafting team does not get a comp pick in the next draft like they would if the draftee refused to sign a good-faith offer. Instead, the drafting team would get a comp pick directly after the end of the first round in the next draft.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
by Fla-Giant on Oct 27, 2025 7:58 PM EDT reply actions
I forgot to add
I would also move the signng deadline to July 15th.
"There ain’t much to being a ballplayer, if you’re a ballplayer." - Honus Wagner
by Fla-Giant on Oct 27, 2025 8:02 PM EDT up reply actions
I dont understand why it seems so many here are against trading draft picks.
I think it just adds another dynamic for skilled GMs to use. If you have a high pick, and you feel confident in your abilities to draft solid talent in the later rounds, and you dont like any of the players left on the board…Why would you not trade your #4 pick for a 2, 3 and say, a 2 next year? Maybe you get an even bigger haul from some impulsive GM with cash to burn and an indifference towards his farm? (I can think of a couple non-small market AL Central teams). I dont buy the argument someone made where players will demand trades to the big market teams. There is no president for that in other sports and is just latent speculation imo.
by dooblay on Oct 28, 2025 9:37 PM EDT reply actions

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