Kendrick Demoted, Sean Rodriguez gets the call
Well I guess that old Kendrick vs. Cano debate was settled rather easily. Rodriguez was hitting .273 with 21 Homers and a 68/20 K/BB in 205 AB. Wood deserved a callup more IMO, hitting .299 with 14 HR and a 36/21 K/BB in 167 ABs, but it seems the organization has soured on him despite his improvement and I really hope they trade him so that he gets an opportunity.
I personally don't think Rodriguez will post a good enough average to substantiate for his high power potential, but I wonder if Kendrick will be given another shot if he can figure out things in the minors or if he will take the Josh Barfield route instead. Well what do you guys think?
0 recs |
36 comments
| Add comment
Comments
Isn't the real question
whether Rodriguez gets an actual shot or if he sits on the bench while Maicer Izturis plays 2B?
RIP Nick Adenhart
by gatling on
Jun 13, 2025 7:08 PM EDT
reply
actions
0 recs
I wish I didn't have to mention that
But clearly the question “Could the Angels really be that stupid?!!!” has only led to disappointment. I’m still guessing that this will chip into both Maicer and Aybar’s playing time, though hopefully Maicer gets far less.
The 2008 Rogelio Moret League Fantasy Baseball Champions!
by The Congo Hammer on
Jun 13, 2025 7:30 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
Considering Maicer's the better player of the two...
“far less” probably wouldn’t be the correct choice.
by PissedMick on
Jun 13, 2025 11:04 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
Good times
Does anybody remember a few years ago when this team was STACKED with quality middle infield prospects at both SS and 2B at like every level of the organization? And then we were all like, “Well, sure, not all of them will make it, but at least a couple of them should turn out to be solid regulars . . .right?”
Just unbelievable. I can’t believe how badly these guys have botched everything. A team with even a mediocre system of player development would have gotten at least a decent middle infield out of the plethora of middle infielders the Angels had. Just hideous.
Sorry Angels fans, I had to do it.
by mrkupe on
Jun 13, 2025 11:48 PM EDT
reply
actions
0 recs
hey well Callaspo's doing pretty well this season
ahahahaha boy that is one sorry looking list. At least Morales is finally coming through, though I still think Brandon Wood will succeed sometime soon.
The 2008 Rogelio Moret League Fantasy Baseball Champions!
by The Congo Hammer on
Jun 14, 2025 12:36 AM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
Callaspo is a stud. :)
baseball rules.
by doublestix on
Jun 14, 2025 5:04 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
"Best Strike Zone Discipline"
Sean Rodriguez
Way to go, BA.
by greg456 on
Jun 14, 2025 9:39 AM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
In fairness
Rodriguez was coming off his 20 year old season in which he had a 78/85 BB/K ratio in 448 ABs . . .so there were numbers to support this assertion.
Of course, look at his competition . . .he had Kendrick (who was at Vlad-like levels of discipline), Brandon Wood (solid patience but would chase even mediocre pitches out of the zone . . .this was when he was coming off his monster 2005 as well, in which his strikeout rate was very high due to his incredibly long swing but not yet at the extreme levels to come), a Cuban (I need say no more), Erick Aybar, and . . .Alberto Callaspo. Callaspo’s managed okay due to his ability to foul off pitches and avoid strikeouts, but his ability to draw walks was never really that strong and wasn’t projected to get any better due to his fringy power. I’m sure you could have found a one-eyed kid who could have handled the zone better than these guys. And Rodriguez, to his credit, actually has two eyes.
by mrkupe on
Jun 14, 2025 12:56 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
If the Angels are sour on Kendrick.
The Mariners will take him off their hands for a shiny new Tonka truck…
Fans are typically idiots.
by The Typical Idiot Fan on
Jun 14, 2025 2:15 AM EDT
reply
actions
0 recs
long time
I know this probably isn’t too permanent but man it took them a long time to figure out that he’s not very good. So after 4 years of being blinded by a empty .300 average it actually took his average hitting rock bottom to figure out, he can’t do anything else!
by GoldenSpikes24 on
Jun 14, 2025 2:21 AM EDT
reply
actions
0 recs
.300+ batting average with power is valuable
Especially for a 2B. The problem this year is that his BABIP simply tumbled
TheSouthWing.com - A Magazine of essays, prose and poems
by OldProspects on
Jun 14, 2025 11:49 AM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
He's passable
The problem is, he was supposed to be a lot more than just passable. As a prospect he was basically the same player he is now, just in terrific hitting environments almost every step of the way. We all knew that his plate discipline was terrible but also that he had an awesome ability to put the bat on the ball. Defense was a significant issue with him. His overall production, however, has not been nearly at the level that was forecasted. He’s hit for average, yes, but he really is the epitome of “empty average” . . .the guy had to hit .322 to approach (but not quite reach) an .800 OPS!
His BABIP this year IS low at .269 . . .but if you add, say, 40 points to that then he still has a whopping .271/.321/.447 (back of napkin conjecture: his current IsoP is at .124, or 65 percent of his OPS . . .I was generous and assumed that with a 40 point BA increase, he would maintain that percentage, making his IsoP .176, total projected slugging percentage of .447). If I did all of this . . .he still has a .768 OPS! So he’s probably getting a bit unlucky, but he’s really not a truly valuable player or somebody that your team should ever REALLY miss unless he can bump that BA over .300, and considering how reliant Kendrick is on the skill of the other team’s defense, that’s never a sure thing.
by mrkupe on
Jun 14, 2025 12:43 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
I would say that playing for Mike Soscia
and for a team that doesnt emphasize a patient approach has really hurt him. Likewise Delmon Young with the Twins.
Kendrick is definitely getting unlucky, but this is what happens to low walk rate players when the hits dont drop in - they look completely useless. That’s the risk you take when you play guys like that. Players who walk a lot are more valuable in general AND more consistent/less vulnerable to bad BAPIP stretches killing their value.
by alskor on
Jun 14, 2025 1:14 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
BABIP is a reflection of talent.
Kendrick’s big problem is not hitting the ball hard. He’s down to a 13% line drive rate.
What’s weird is that he’s not swinging at more garbage out of the zone and making more contact on pitches overall, but is having bad results. When you use results to base your analysis, players look really bad. He’s actually increased his walk rate slightly so far this year and cut down on his strikeouts more than before. He’s also hitting more home runs per fly ball.
Everything except his results says he’s doing better than he did in years previous. The thing about extreme ground ball hitters is that they will have big stretches where nothing gets through. Kendrick is suffering through one of those stretches. That the Angels aren’t willing to be patient with him is a sign of shoddy player management.
Fans are typically idiots.
by The Typical Idiot Fan on
Jun 14, 2025 3:50 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
He’s hitting the ball well less often than in the past. Often when a guy is doing that his walk rate may rise some because he’s scuffling and looking for any way to get on base. That’s not a good thing, at least in terms of predictive value. For instance, it has been shown that with aging sluggers who have their walk rates rise it may very well be a sign they are really finished. I agree with you he has been unlucky, but I cant agree that “[e]verything except his results says he’s doing better than he did in years previous.”
Career:
BB rate: 3.4%
K rate: 17.7%
LD rate: 16.5%
2009:
BB rate: 5.1%
K rate: 19.9%
LD rate: 13%
Looking at these components I dont see a guy who is doing better than in previous years. I see a guy who is struggling, who is making poor contact and who probably is trying to be more patient because he knows he’s not going well. Just because he’s walking a little bit more doesnt he’s doing better than in previous years… It’s a miniscule amount, really - 10 walks on the season raw total. If he has one less walk would you be making the same claim…? Is that one extra walk really indicative of an improved performance…?
Kendrick just isnt that good a hitter. His lack of selectivity really hurts him. When he’s going good and the hits are dropping he’s an okay 2B. When the hits arent falling he really sucks.
by alskor on
Jun 14, 2025 4:15 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
+1
Kendrick just isn’t that good a hitter.
Is there really anything more that needs to be said here?
Same guy, new name.
by stillredsoxfan on
Jun 14, 2025 4:18 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
Hey, just curious where you got your stats...
I’d really like to see the minor league trend line with Kendrick. I was following him for a while, and his low BB rate and high BABIP rates were yellow flags early, but he had good LD% and maintained the high BABIP for several years, so I thought he could’ve been an Ichiro-type hitter, just a high BABIP career hitter. I expected a 300 hitter who could hit 50-60 XBH a year, and if he was at the top of a solid lineup, he could be a solid fantasy player.
He came in 2007 and did what I’d expected, he hit over 30 XBH in 353 PAs, his LD% was a little elevated, as was his BABIP vs what I thought he’d do. But overall his performance was what I expected. But his XBH% was not good at all, which should’ve been a yellow flag, in the minors it had been around 39%, and was 28%.
The same in 2008, his LD% came down a little, as did his BABIP and overall stats, but still kinda what I expected, 30+ XBH in 361 PAs. His XBH still was not good at 30. I was chalking some of this under performing to health.
This year his LD% tanked, as did his BABIP, and his value tanked, and they dropped him. Not sure if this was him pressing or what because he had a really good spring. Still, just hitting 30% of his hits for XBH. This after a solid spring.
So you’re looking at a 360 lifetime minor league hitter, who hit over 39% of his hits in full season ball for XBH, so its not like a Jeremy Reed situation, he was hitting things solidly in the minors, at every stop. But in the majors, he didn’t seem to be making as solid contact as he had before, as almost 10% fewer of his hits were going for extra bases.
I’m not ready to write him off yet. He was universally considered a batting champ type player. His performances in the minors were pretty consistent, good LD%, good XBH%, high BABIP. So what went wrong? Did one of those injuries cause him to change his approach? Is he hurt?
Poster formerly known as artie
by beastball on
Jun 14, 2025 4:52 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
1) Minor league LD rates = THROW THEM AWAY. They are not kept correctly and are entirely useless. The average for the Cal League is something like 6%. The scoring is just not anywhere close to reliable and nothing can be learned from them.
2) The Angels have a minor league system littered with some of the most hitter friendly parks in baseball. That’s part of it. The minor league averages are inflated. They arent at all indicative of his true talent level. They are indicative of an underlying ability to perhaps be a .300 hitter… but not unless he gets more selective.
Im sure Kendrick isnt this bad… but he’s not that good, either. His patience and selectivity have stagnated. His approach with his current skill levels isn’t one that is conducive to batting titles. To me, it looks like he’s .280/.320/430ish. Not so hot. If he gets a little unlucky in batting average and the hits dont fall (like in 2009) then he looks like hot crap. Im certainly not writing him off. In fact, my first post blamed the Angels and Soscia for sort of playing to his weaknesses. I could easily see him having a year where he’s as lucky as he’s been unlucky this year… maybe he hits .320, something like that. Very possible. He was still very overrated coming into 09.
by alskor on
Jun 14, 2025 5:22 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
Yeah...
I understand about LD%, and so my post may have misrepresented my opinion of it. I remember arguing the fact that the usefulness of LD% is suspect, at best, however it can sometimes indicate someone who is overperforming. So that’s how I was using it.
Anyway, I’m not sure where to lay the blame.
I suppose based on your response I should blame the Angel’s minor league system for being loaded with parks that inflate performance. But at the same time, everyone had this guy as a top 10 prospect and were predicting batting titles and everything. So not sure I could blame it on the development side. They kinda did what they were supposed to do, seems to me.
I tend to want to blame the major league staff because based on his first two years, it seemed this guy was a 300 doubles hitter with 10 homer power, but they couldn’t get him out of his funk.
For me, his 2007/2008 performances were what I expected except for the lower XBH rates, and they are still what I’d expect from him moving forward when he gets back to the majors.
However, assuming the worst, and this is why I wanted to know where you got your stats, so we could track trending. Trending isn’t perfect, but it’s what threw up yellow flags about D Young, and demonstrated Dukes was on the right track, and Young on the wrong one. So I wonder if there was some data points that might have foretold his fall.
Poster formerly known as artie
by beastball on
Jun 14, 2025 6:17 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
My point isnt that LD rates arent important or useful - Just minor league LD rates.
The other issue that we havent mentioned with Kendrick is his inability to stay healthy.
by alskor on
Jun 14, 2025 7:36 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
Book marked!
Thanks! I kept seeing that site mentioned, and kept forgetting to book mark it. I got PitchFX and fangraphs bookmarked now.
I guess my point back then wasn’t about the reliability of the tracking of the stat, but that it didn’t correlate well with performance. What I do use it for is to possibly indicate someone whose stats aren’t truly reflective of their performance. So if they had a real low LD%, but high BABIP, then that might indicate more luck than someone with high LD%
Yeah, to me health has alot to do with it, and why I was wondering if he’s really healthy right now. If he could’ve stayed on the field in 2007/08, he would have had two years with close to 200 hits, 40 doubles, and 50 XBH, which wouldn’t be bad at all. And if that had happened, would he have been demoted this time around?
And I don’t think this is a Barfield situation, Kendrick sustained elevated performances for a longer period and was generally more highly regarded.
Anyway, I may go back and pour over his trends to see if something comes up.
Poster formerly known as artie
by beastball on
Jun 14, 2025 8:09 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
I missed the strikeout rate. I was looking in the wrong spot.
10 walks is 10 more times on base and 10 more times not making an out. Over the course of 600 plate appearances, it may not seem like much, but it’s worth a full 0.013 points of wOBA.
Anyway, in years past he’s seen 3.28 pitches per PA (2007) and 3.45 pitches per PA (2008). It’s up to 3.66 now. Seeing more pitches per plate appearances is not a bad thing. It’s an indication of patience and being selective. It also means he’ll take more walks, which is a good thing. There is a strong correlation between taking pitches and productivity.
His ISO power is right in line with his career line. So if he’s making weaker contact, it’s not being reflected there. Actually, his HR / FB is up to 9.5%, which is considerably higher than he’s had it ever before and is getting closer to league average. HIs previous years have been horrible.
His contact rate overall is 78%, right in line with his career norms and he’s hitting pitches over the plate right about where he should be, a 91% rate. So he’s having no problems putting wood on the ball. He’s swinging at garbage less, 34.9% out of zone (37.1% career average). High contact rates are good for the hacktastic. If they’re swinging and missing more, then they’re in trouble.
StatCorner (www.statcorner.com) has some other stats that they track. Of the 741 pitches he’s seen, he’s swung at 50.7% of them, missing 21% of the time, and thus making contact 79% of the time. Here’s the trick, his ball in play percentage of the times he makes contact is at 50.8’%, lowest he’s ever been (57.9% in 2008, 61.7% in 2007). (Statcorner also reports he’s taking more balls and fewer strikes.)
So what does this mean? Fouling off more pitches? Is this an indicator of a lack of hitting talent? I said it before, and I"ll say it again, none of the other stats seem to be indicating that he should be putting up worse numbers than before.
Except one. The line drive rate. It is clear that he’s not squaring up pitches like he has in the past, and that’s killing him. The question, then, is whether it’s a question of talent or a question of injury or something else. I don’t think it’s talent. If he was a true talent 13% line drive guy, he’d have done that the whole time. Seems to me that there’s something else bugging Kendrick. He may not be healthy. He may be completely frustrated and pressing. I don’t know, but I don’t think he’s just not “that good a hitter”.
There are certainly good arguments to be made for his overhype in the minors, but I don’t think his skill sets are that flawed that they can’t reach some level of major league success. Not all star, but still useful.
By the by, he’s on pace to be a 1.5 win player with his glove at second. So his defense isn’t in question.
Fans are typically idiots.
by The Typical Idiot Fan on
Jun 14, 2025 8:19 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
Don't Get This At All
When you use results to base your analysis, players look really bad.
Everything except his results says he’s doing better than he did in years previous.
Results matter. Production matters. What else is there? How long are they going to keep running him out there without him producing? Look at his career numbers. He’s only had one year (partial season) where his wOBA was above (barely) average. Dude is just not that good.
Same guy, new name.
by stillredsoxfan on
Jun 14, 2025 4:27 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
Past results are not necessarily an indication of future performance.
Pretty simple, really.
We can use certain stats that are heavily reflected in the skill sets (LD%, for example) to predict future performance or to discover anomalies and aberrations. We don’t take someone’s results as a genuine reflection of talent unless it correlates to the skill sets.
In this case, I think he’s making more contact, which should equal more balls in play, which should even out over time to mean more base hits as well as more outs. Kendrick’s line drive rate is the only thing that bothers me.
Fans are typically idiots.
by The Typical Idiot Fan on
Jun 14, 2025 8:00 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
Subject
Past results are not necessarily an indication of future performance.
I agree with this. Totally. 100%. I just don’t think you understand my point of view though. What about his actual production? You know like getting on base and scoring runs or being able to drive them in. Just look at his career line: .294 .324 .417 While his average is nice and all, do you think that’s the line of a productive hitter?
How do we know that 2007 and 2008 weren’t the fluke years? His BABIPs were .382 and .362 (I used Fangraphs BABIP which was a point or two higher than THT and Statcorner). Aren’t those ridiculously high? Even with those numbers he couldn’t get his OBP over .350.
So I’ll ask it again. Where is his production? Does it really matter how much contact he makes if nothing good is happening as a result, when he does makes it?
Same guy, new name.
by stillredsoxfan on
Jun 14, 2025 9:28 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
Don't get me wrong.
The player definitely has to go out there and live up to his expectations. After all, if Random AAA Scrub A goes out there and hits like Kendrick has, well you don’t really care. Some might call it a surprise. Some might call it a fluke. Either way, it’s a decent result and you’d take it. Kendrick, though, like all of our touted prospects that we observe, is expected to do more. Part of that expectation was probably unreasonable, but the rest should be his to determine.
To answer your last question: we use skill set analysis to help us determine whether Kendrick, or anybody, will ever produce. If he’s still showing signs that he can be a good hitter, then we watch and wait. In the meantime, he’s playing good defense, so you can suffer with it. If he was a lead glove, you’d be even more hard pressed to warrant giving him playing time.
What I’m saying is that while he’s not producing now, that doesn’t mean he wont. For a team like the Angels, who are in the middle of a playoff hunt, that may not be acceptable. For a team like the Mariners who are in a transitory phase, it’s preferable to know what you have for the future. Still, it doesn’t mean you react to results, which is what the Angels seem to be doing here.
But, honestly, it’s now up to Kendrick to figure out what’s wrong in a low stress environment and recover what he’s lost.
Fans are typically idiots.
by The Typical Idiot Fan on
Jun 15, 2025 12:12 AM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
Low stress?
What could be higher stress than “you sucked, you lost your job, and you’re not getting it back unless you hit and hit soon”?
The crowds might be smaller but make no mistake, if Kendrick’s not feeling some serious heat to shape up and improve his game, the Angels might want to send him off to Rancho Cucomonga to get the point across.
by mrkupe on
Jun 15, 2025 12:32 AM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
Yes, low stress.
If you don’t believe the minors are less stressful, I don’t know what to tell you. It’s a more relaxed, controlled environment, where there’s no pressure on him to succeed immediately. He can take his time, work on his game, with no manager breathing down his neck, no fanbase booing him, and he’s not feeling like he’s muffing the team over in a pennant race.
His losing his job and being demoted are not extra pressure added. It’s deflating, possibly defeating. It’s more of a punishment and finality rather than a daily grind of gears against his testicles.
Would you prefer “lower” stress? Would that help you understand it? It’s certainly not the same. And it’s not more.
Fans are typically idiots.
by The Typical Idiot Fan on
Jun 16, 2025 2:15 AM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
How bout this swap........
Kelly Johnson for Howie Kendrick?
by Jay212033 on
Jun 15, 2025 2:12 AM EDT
reply
actions
0 recs
Angels hitters are flat-out overrated
Their system seems to produce guys who just don’t live up to the expectations. Wood, Kendrick, Mathis and so on. And their pitchers seem to be underrated. So take any results coming out of their system with a grain of salt and downgrade the bats and upgrade the arms.
by Flynn Blake on
Jun 15, 2025 7:13 AM EDT
reply
actions
0 recs
What has Wood been given a chance to prove?
by aap212 on
Jun 15, 2025 9:06 AM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
No matter how good Wood turns out...
he was defintiely overrated after his huge year in the Cal league.
by PissedMick on
Jun 15, 2025 10:42 AM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
But he's been underrated ever since
The hype machine died out on him hard after his 2006 season, and he should have more hype after his monstrous 2008-2009 numbers, especially as he’s still young and a defensively adequate if not solid SS.
The 2008 Rogelio Moret League Fantasy Baseball Champions!
by The Congo Hammer on
Jun 15, 2025 9:34 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
Agreed.
Wood is definitely a player who causes many to focus on what he can’t do rather than what he can.
by PissedMick on
Jun 15, 2025 10:16 PM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs
That's called "analysis".
It sometimes sucks.
But I do agree that Wood has not been given enough time to learn the majors. He’s seen 200 PAs and some folks are writing him off awfully early. I don’t think he’ll be an all star, but he could certainly still be a good major league regular. Needs to seriously learn how to put wood… no pun intended… on the ball more often.
Fans are typically idiots.
by The Typical Idiot Fan on
Jun 16, 2025 2:21 AM EDT
up
reply
actions
0 recs








