Metty5's Top 50**
Top 50 Prospects with NO MLB experience. I figured I'd get into the action.
I like this better because it gets names flowing back and forth. Having Matt Welters, McCutchen, and F-Mart a top a list has been the same for several years. Not that I believe these players aren’t prospects, I’m just looking for fresh names to generate conversation.
I obviously missed people. But let me know what you think and I'll try and make adjustments and answer questions. I hope the blurbs help with the rationale. I mostly use Fangraphs, FI, MiLB.com, and Splits.
Also, I want to apologize for any grammar/spelling//anything that looks weird. I did this pretty quickly.
If anyone wants more detailed conversation you can reach me at J.D.Sussman@gmail.com.
- Jason Heyward – This kills me as a Mets fan, but this guy is the complete package. Offensively he will hit for more power as he gets older (which is scary), and I haven’t heard a single negative thing about his defense. Only positive.
- Jesus Montero – No, he isn’t a catcher. But he has the best bat in the minors. He is tearing up AA at 19.
- Jarrod Parker – Great fastball and two other plus offerings make him my top pitcher. The walks have been up in AA, but he should settle those back down.
- Madison Bumgarner – Like parker, the strikes outs are down, and the walks are up in AA. He does have some regressing to do with his great strand rate and career HR/9 rate. I do worry about his secondary offering, but all reports are that it has improved.
- Chris Tillman – In my opinion, he is a larger version of Parker with 3 plus offerings. Born in the same year as Bumgarner and Parker, he is already in AAA. His walk rate is down and he is still striking out over a better an inning.
- Justin Smoak – Smoak is probably the most polished player in the minor leagues, he is a great hitter and fielder. The Rangers were very lucky he dropped to them in the draft. He is already in AAA after dominating AA walking more times than he struck out (39 to 35).
- Carlos Santana – As you can see in the MLB a good hitting back stop is tough to come by. Santana has great athleticism, and will be a good MLB back stop. Clearly, he can crush the ball as well. He has huge power, and very underrated plate discipline (His BB:SO is 58:42).
- Mat Latos – Latos has really came into his own this season posting great numbers in both A and AA. His FIP stands at 2.06 in AA and while his HR rate will certainly change that once a few go out of the park, he has been dominate. There are some injury concerns, but no one will complain about a 4.33 K/BB ratio.
- Brian Matusz – Like Latos, Matusz has been dominating this year. His walk rate is slightly higher than I expected for him based on the reports I heard. However they aren’t anything to worry about, just higher than expected. Also higher than expect is his strikeout rate. Matusz has stuck out an impressive 96 batters in 85 IP. With great control and several plus pitches Matsuz could make an impact next season.
- Buster Posey – I’ve heard good things about his defense behind the plate, but I’m honestly not sure I’ve heard enough to say anything on way or another about it. His bat is another story. He has raked this season posting a 425 wOBA in A+ ball. I’m excited to see what he’ll do at the next level.
- Mike Stanton – Although he has hit a rough patch in AA, one can’t forget the 430 wOBA he put up in 750 PA before reaching AA (starting last season). It has only been 100 AB in AA, so it isn’t concern yet.
- Pedro Alvarez – Yes, thus far he has been disappointing, but his huge potential is still there, and I have faith he will figure things out. He needs to cut down the strike outs. Even scarier than the SO rate is the LD rate. I don’t know if that will regress to the mean, or mean his demise, but 8% at Lynchburg is awful. With that said, his power is still at the top of the minor league food chain.
- Jhoulys Chacin – I love the way the Rockies are challenging him while at the same time letting him get comfortable at each level. I’m hoping they leave him in AA all year. While he doesn’t miss bats at the elite level, he isn’t a slouch. He’ll get groundballs and miss bats enough to make him a very solid number two starter in Colorado that is a difficult task.
- Logan Morrison – Although he missed a lot of time early in the year, he is doing fantastic at AA hitting 5 HR in just under 100 AB and walking more than he is SO. He seems to have great bat control and has a 400 wOBA despite a lowish (but not too low) BABIP. To me, he is a very safe bet to be a successful hitter at the major league level.
- Chris Carter – You’ll notice a slew (3) 1B prospects in the next several spots. I wrote about Carter briefly the other day. While the SO are a concern, his power is real.
- Lars Anderson – He has had his fair share of struggles in AA, but is still very young (and a HUGE 6-5). He’ll put it together, but I’d like to see his walk rate and ISO creep back up.
- Josh Vitters – His walk rate is non-existent, but his pedigree and 50 point jump in SO (15 HR this season) make him a great prospect. From what I hear, staying at 3B isn’t a problem. I like that his SO rate has dropped, but he needs to walk more, for now, I’ll chalk that up to lack of experience and youth.
- Neftali Feliz – While his stock has dropped in the eyes of many, I never had him THAT high to begin with. Everyone on these lists are in the top 1% of players or something like that… Anyway, he still throws as hard as anyone, and the worst case scenario is that he ends up as a dominate relief pitcher. However, I have higher hopes.
- Brett Lawrie - As a 2B Lawrie in a good spot, if he moves to the OF, he probably falls in the 35 range for me. He has good power, a nice ISO, and a very respectable BB rate. The position will determine his future, because
he'll need more power at a corner outfield spot.He certainly doesn't need power per today's numbers. I'm not sure how "real" it is, and would like a larger sample size. If he continues to produce a 200 ISO from second base and maintains the rest of his numbers, he'll climb even higher. I do want more reports on his 2B defense, obviously without real minor league defensive data it is hard to make an accurate statement. - Jenrry Mejia – I see him a lot like people saw Feliz last year. Though, my understanding is that his changeup is a better offering than what Feliz is/was showing. He is only 19 and holding his own in AA and missing a ton of bats.
- Kyle Drabek – He is about two years older than Mejia, but his numbers have been nasty in A+ ball. Striking out over 10 per 9 with a 1.82 FIP. Of course, that has to do with Drabek not allowing a single HR in 61.2 IP. His rates have dropped significantly in 20 less IP in AA, but I’d expect him to rebound has he gets more comfortable.
- Michael Taylor – Talk about a breakout. Taylor, 22, is putting on a clinic in AA. His wOBA is 442, however is this really a breakout when he has been over 400 for the past 500 AB? He could be a superstar.
- Brett Wallace – Sometimes it is hard to peg the young guys who are being challenged, but I am really confidence in Wallace’s bat. Where he winds up defensively is another story. If he stays at third he’ll be even higher up the list. I think his walk rate will bounce back over time as well.
- Jake Arrieta – I like him a good deal, he misses a good chuck of bats, gets ground balls, and is consistent. ERA and FIPs of 2008: 2.87/3.39 2009: 2.59/3.08, 2.92/3.08. I think his K rate will increase in AAA as well.
- Dominic Brown – Though he really needs to be challenged in AA, he has been great in A+ ball with a 410 wOBA. He has the tools and they seem to be turning into skills.
- Tim Alderson – I’m a fan of him, though I don’t see his ceiling higher than a 3rd starter. I honestly believe his strange leg kick effects minor league hitters to a small degree. With that said, it is hard to argue with his command and minor league numbers.
- Tyler Flowers – He is doing very well in AA, I didn’t realize how old he was though. I thought he was around 20, but he is 22 and a January birthday as well. There are still questions about his defense, but the bat seems to be for real. He needs to cut down the SO though.
- Michael Saunders – How can’t one love what he is doing this season? I really like Canadian prospects because when they break out, they tend to explode and that is what Saunders ahs done this year.
- Casey Kelly – I’m a believer, though I hope he gains some velocity on his fastball so he can be a true number 1. If he is sitting at 90 he’ll have to rely on his already great control and secondary stuff, which isn’t always easy to do. Given his youth and desire to play SS, I love the way BOS is handling him.
- Dee Gordon – I’m a big believer in his bat and walk ability. The steals are pretty insane and given how raw he is, he really could break out even further.
- Hector Rondon - He is doing really well in AA, has good rates, and very little regression from what I can see. I love that his BB have decreased from last year.
- Brad Holt – It is exciting to see a few Mets prospects on a top 50 list for something other than hype, but Holt is very similar to some other high velocity SP. He has a high floor because he would probably be successful in an MLB pen today. His AA sample size is way too small to even make mention. But his other numbers are fantastic.
- Martin Perez – It almost seems that you could have entire top 50 list filled with young Texas pitching, but Perez’s SO rate really stands out for someone born in the 90s (4/4/91). If he can get his walks down even slightly, I think he’ll be a top 10 pitcher when everyone a top this list graduates next year.
- Desmond Jennings – Tools and sometimes hurt, Jennings has been outstanding this season. He could be a 7 skill player when he reaches the majors. His injury tendency is a concern though.
- Yonder Alonso – His small sample size in AA is disappointing, but then again it is a SSS. His A+ ball numbers were expected. He needs to bring his game up in AA, and I think he will.
- Matthew Moore – Has he walked a ton of people? Yes. Has he also struck out 13 batters per 9? Yes. Even with the high walk rate he has only allowed 44 hits this season in 70.2 IP. He also has some slight GB tendencies.
- Jordan Lyles – Another filthy youngster, Lyles brings both stuff and control to the hill for the Astros. He might have been slightly over looked last year with an abnormal HR rate added to his season line in 2 A- starts.
- Jason Knapp – All three of these guys have put up remarkable numbers, but you can’t mention the first two without mention Knapp too. This 6’5” righty also misses a ton of bats.
- Nick Barnese –Barnese gets a ton of GB, but was gimpy to start the year. Sadly, this season he has a small sample size, just 28 IP (1.29 ERA, 19:6 SO: BB). But last season he was dominate striking out 84 in 66 IP.
- Freedie Freeman - I like Freedie, but I have some concerns. First, his stats are very BA dependant and he has a very high BABIP. I'd like to see him gain a few percentage points in his walk rate and add at least 50 points to his ISOP. He is young, but without the pop he won't be a major leaguer.
- Adrian Cardenas – Very consistent for a IF, though I believe it remains to be seen if he could play 2B at the MLB level. Most likely he’ll be at 3B with Weeks at 2B. I do believe that hurts is value some because he doesn’t have 3B power. His on base skills are great though. The power could be developed down the line.
- Brandon Snyder – I was hoping that it would be Rowell that had the break out. But it was Snyder who increased his BB rate and his ISO significantly in AA this year. If he can cut down the walks and his power continues to develop he could certainly replace Huff next season.
- Chris Heisey – The oldest guy on this list, Heisey broke out this year with a .457 wOBA in AA. Cutting down his SO rate had to help, and I’m sure those additional HRs didn’t hurt either.
- Derek Norris – A bright light for the Nationals in terms of hitting, Norris has great pop and instincts at the plate, but it remains to be seen if he’ll stick behind it. Moving to 1B would really hurt his value. The Nationals aren’t going anywhere though, and can be leisurely with their efforts to move him off catcher.
- Jemile Weeks – Weeks is electric and has shown more pop than I think anyone expected with 7 HR in his first 28 games. He does strike out a bit much for my liking, though maybe it is his size that makes me think lead-off hitter.
- Wilmer Flores – While I didn’t really like the ARL take that the Mets had with F-Mart and him “holding his own” all those years in the minor leagues, I do like Flores a lot. The fact that be blasted 8 balls last season at age 16 is amazing to me. While he hasn’t hacked in the minor leagues, his ISO has been sliced in half from last year to this one.
- Thomas Neal – Old for A+ ball, and I think he needs to jump to AA to justify this spot. Its hard to ignore the 13 HRs he has hit thus far though.
- Nick Weglarz – I’ve never been high on him, but he has been very consistent. Can he stay in the OF? If he can, that’ll make him have solid value if he doesn’t butch the ball. He is a walk machine, who hits for very solid power.
- Lonnie Chisenhall – The doubled SO rate stands out to me, but so does almost three times the amount of HRs. If he can stick at SS, I think he’ll skyrocket (if he keeps the SO down too).
- Wade Davis – I used to love him, now I’m not so high on him because of the iffy SO rate when added to the iffy BB rate. He is a solid three.
- Tim Beckham – I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt (but not Hosmer). The scariest part of his not so hot numbers is the high BABIP, SO rate, and low walk rates. On the surface his triple slash line of 283/338/420 look decent for a SS, but the wOBA of 337 is just too low for a number one overall pick. He needs to cut down the SO and take some bases.
- Robbie Ross – Ross is a small lefty, but is missing bats at an alarming rate. His 15.05 K/9 is outstanding. But he also has the control, 1.77 BB/9 really stands out for someone his age. His strand rate is very high, but so his BABIP. I think his numbers will get better as his BABIP normalizes, and maybe with less base runners his strand rate too will normalize with less negative effect. He has also been a groundball machine (65%). If though it has only be 20 IP, I’d like to see him start the second half in A+ ball, skipping A.
DISCLOSURE: THE FOLLOWING PLAYERS ARE ON MY FANTASY TEAM, WHICH I HAVE DRAFTED OVER THE PAST FEW YEARS. IT IS A VERY VERY DEEP LEAGUE WITH HUNDREDS OF MINOR LEAGUERS ON EACH TEAM.
PARKER, TILLMAN, MORRISON, CARTER, KELLY, RONDON, BARNESE, ROSS. RECENTLY I'VE TRADED VILLALONA, ALDERSON, LATOS, CODY JOHNSON, GREG HALMAN, NOLAN REIMOLD.
I think my rationale backs up my opinions well. This isn't just another baseless list. I don't believe I have a bias towards my guys, but you can be the judge. If you would like to hear more from me (I have tons of time in the summer) let me know by posting something or rec'ing this.
Rip away.
~Metty
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Not sure why it comes up like that, sorry. I'm having trouble fixing it. Maybe later tonight.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 6, 2025 5:39 PM EDT
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pedro
why does he get the benefit of the doubt, but not beckham or hosmer?
baseball rules.
by doublestix on
Jul 6, 2025 5:46 PM EDT
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re: Pedro
I just don’t see how you can even call him a top 30 prospect anymore. He has almost no shot at staying at third base, and has significant contact issues. I think I’d even rank someone like Freddie Freeman ahead of him, at this point.
by jar75 on
Jul 6, 2025 6:25 PM EDT
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Disagree
1st — I did give Beckham some benefit, not Hosmer. For Hosmer, I didn’t because the only positive I see are the walks, everything else seems pretty awful IMO. He’d be around 65-75 based on pedigree till mid-year next season, then re-evaluated based on a bigger sample size.
Alvarez is interesting. First, even with those sh!tty numbers, he still had a 363 wOBA, which is impressive. His walk rate is very very respectable, the SO rate obviously is scary. His ISO is still very high. If he moves to first, I still this he has more power than all of them except maybe Carter, but I think he could stick at 3B.
The real question is his LD . If that is fluky and he gets that up to a low 15 his numbers sky rocket. If he gets that up into prospect status of 20%, then he is in a great place. I stand by him at 12, its a small sample size thus far.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 6, 2025 9:22 PM EDT
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Rebuttal
I think Hosmer is a much easier prospect to forgive when you note his age and the fact that he’s playing in the midwest League, but that’s not really my point…
I don’t think it’s an ‘if’ anymore, a move to first is just about inevitable for Pedro Alvarez. We should start evaluating him as a first baseman (just like the adjustments we make for the eventual shift of Montero and Flores defensively). Yeah, he has massive power potential, but so do a lot of guys, let’s compare Pedro and Cody Johnson:
Johnson:
BB%: 12.2
K%: 37.6
ISO: .308
Alvarez:
BB%: 13.2
K%: 28.8
ISO: .239
These numbers are only 2009 in the Carolina League. Johnson is a year and a half younger than Pedro and has been rather similar. No one would even think about calling Johnson a top 100 prospect (would he even make the Braves’ top 10?) because of his contact issues, yet Pedro stays in the top 15?
Isn’t batted ball data for the minor leaguers incredibly inaccurate? I certainly wouldn’t rely on LD% to keep Alvarez in the top 15. So the question is, why is he better than Logan Morrison, Freddie Freeman, Lars Anderson, Chris Carter, or even Yonder Alonso? It has to be because of his pedigree. That’s fine if you still think he is the premier hitter that he was touted as, but I’m starting to have my doubts.
by jar75 on
Jul 7, 2025 9:12 AM EDT
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Re:Rebuttal
I think you made good points.
First, I would have Cody Johnson as a top 100 prospect at this point. His power is enormous and his walk rate is solid.
Second, you are correct, batted ball data isn’t accurate for the minor leagues. But I really doubt that its 10 percentage points off, probably just a couple. Without Gameday in the minor leagues, it is tough to accurately assign. But I’m confident that 8% is close enough to what he is doing. Some other players on his team have good LD%: Tabata (21) Friday (17), others have around 15, and others are around 8. I do want to see what he does in a larger sample size. 240 AB isn’t enough.
And I do give him some slack for his pedigree. He was an extremely high rated player, a consensus top player. Do I think he should be in AA? No. But maybe there were issues at Lynchburg that warranted his advancement, I don’t know.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 9:57 AM EDT
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Not a rip, but a question
Why Parker over Tillman, whom you consider a bigger and more advanced Parker?
The monster at the end of this blog.
by grover on
Jul 6, 2025 6:13 PM EDT
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Parker V Tillman
I love them both, I feel Parker has a better fastball, and can dial it up higher. Otherwise its a two spot difference.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 6, 2025 9:16 PM EDT
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The Yankees and Montero
They would do well to keep their DH spot free of 37 year old dead weight next year.
by Fanon on
Jul 6, 2025 6:46 PM EDT
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Note on Mejia
He’s now on the DL with a finger strain. Potentially useful to limit his innings count, but something to keep an eye on.
by Fanon on
Jul 6, 2025 6:48 PM EDT
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it's a bunch of BS
He’s not hurt at all. Saw him on the dugout rail having a great time today with no signs of a finger injury.
by Bravesin07 on
Jul 6, 2025 6:58 PM EDT
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Parker
jarrod parker hassnt given up a homerun the entire year and hes got a very good fastball. the only facet of his game he needs to work on is command. im not worried about the command issue, since hes never really had such problems in the past
by iam2asian4u on
Jul 6, 2025 7:02 PM EDT
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Best list thus far, even with Alvarez at 12
good work.
and for guys in my keeper league… 8 of my prospects on this list. :-)
by daveh33 on
Jul 6, 2025 7:23 PM EDT
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Good list
My one complaint is I think Lawrie should definitely make the top-50 and possibly be at the top part of it. If you compare his production to Moustakas’ last year, they’re virtually the same (Lawrie shows more speed and a bit more walks, but more CS). Defensively, much depends on if Lawrie can stay at second, but even if he is forced to move to the OF, he should be ranked close to where Moustakas was (#13 in BA).
The other teenager whose numbers from last year Lawrie resembles in Jason Heyward. Lawrie showed substantially more power and speed, though virtually identical walk and strikeout numbers. Heyward, however, was 18, while Lawrie is 19. If Lawrie is forced to go to the OF, then I think Heyward was then (#5 according to BA) a substantially better prospect than Lawrie, but if by the end of the year scouts think that Lawrie can stay at 2nd and be a decent defensive player there, I think there is a reasonable argument that he should be considered for a top 10 slot.
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by OldProspects on
Jul 6, 2025 7:41 PM EDT
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my mistake
I didn’t omit Lawrie, Freedman, or Moustakas, I forgot them. Tonight, I’ll put them in where I see fit.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 6, 2025 9:15 PM EDT
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Latos?
What about Latos? He is a guy who has not been showing up on these lists but could easily end the season as a top 20 prospect.
by tt68 on
Jul 6, 2025 9:19 PM EDT
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Latos is there.
Number 8
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by Metty5 on
Jul 6, 2025 9:23 PM EDT
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I didn't mean to criticize you specifically
It seems in general people think of him in the 40s or 50s, and that was what I was responding to
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by OldProspects on
Jul 6, 2025 11:14 PM EDT
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oh not at all
I did this in about an hour, so I knew I missed people. They are in there now.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 6, 2025 11:57 PM EDT
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Out of curiosity
Why do you think Lawrie needs to add power if he moves to a corner outfield spot? Before the season started, people were describing him as having plus-plus power potential. He’s 19 and his ISOP is .200 - virtually the same as Moustakas had last year at the same level and same age at a corner infield spot, and higher than Heyward had, albeit at a year younger. His isolated power is also, incidentally, substantially higher than Smoak’s, even though Smoak is already 22.
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by OldProspects on
Jul 7, 2025 1:51 AM EDT
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Your right
When I first looked at his rates I noticed a pretty big HR/PA of 36, then I realized I did the math wrong and he was at 32, and then I calculated Carter, Morrison, Lars, etc. And he falls in their range. So my glance didn’t give him the due diligence he deserved.
He is young, and I certainly need to see more sample size to think the ISOp is for real. His 3B can be fluky, but a 19 year old in the top 20 is no knock. I’m going to adjust my comment though.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 10:28 AM EDT
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Moustakas
I see you added Lawrie and Freeman but not Moustakas. Is he outside your top 50?
by joerote on
Jul 7, 2025 9:33 AM EDT
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just slightly
He would be around 55, and I’ll do a write up on him. I had him in a keeper league and traded him, but thats not why he is dropped obviously.
First, I think he has some regression to the mean in his favor. His IFFB rate is extreme, if that drops to a normal 8% (1/3 of what it is now) he’ll be in a much better place with his BABIP and likely his stats as well.
But also the walk rate is scary. Strike outs really don’t bother me as much as walk rates excite me. While SO isn’t ever positive, if you can’t walk, you are going to have problems. If you look at the top 35 in wOBA, you’ll notice only 5 batters are below 10 in walk rate. Ibanez, Cabrera, Crawford, Sandoval and Rolen. With only Ibanez, and Crawford having a career mark below 10.
Additionally, if you look at players with the top BB% most of them correlate with good wOBA expect for a few.
That doesn’t mean Moustakas wouldn’t be a productive hitter, but if he is playing the OF or even 3B, he’ll need to have extreme power to make up for his lack of on base skills. While he projects that power, I haven’t seen it enough. Yes, he hit 22 HR last season, but his doubles were low.
I’d like to see more of him in the second half, and progress in his walk rate.
I’m a big fan of him, and I think he’ll have a nice second half, but right now he is just outside.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 10:10 AM EDT
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agree
He’s been a bit disappointing this year. Based on his 2nd half last year and his rankings heading into the year, I was pretty excited about him heading into the year. I would say my expectations for his ceiling are definitely much lower compared to when he was drafted.
by joerote on
Jul 7, 2025 12:48 PM EDT
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I really like this list
Like everyone, there are rankings here I disagree with somewhat, but I don’t see anything that really sticks out as “off base” or anything of the sort. I love the ranking of the 1B prospects in the top 15(Morrison/Carter/Anderson). I argued for Morrison over Anderson on the Community list in the offseason, and I don’t see any reason for that to have changed now(Morrison’s injury is offset by Anderson’s early struggles). Carter has gone out and improved his game where it needed it and still maintains the huge power, so I can see him above Anderson and wouldn’t quibble if he was ahead of Morrison. I am curious to see where Freeman ends up when you slot him in later, I think he’s a notch below these three at least, but he’s very young and has the potential to be in that range next year.
I love the placement of Chacin, the Philly 3(Taylor over Brown doesn’t seem to be the popular way to go, but I see nothing wrong with), Rondon/Moore/Barnese, and Wade Davis. I’m not as bullish on some of the guys in the 40’s, but I think there is probably 25 names you could consider from 40-50 pretty easily and it could end up a solid list in the end.
Finally, I really like the idea of leaving out guys with MLB experience. I know that just because has played in the bigs, whether it’s been a few games or he’s passed the rookie standards of 130 AB’s/50 IP, that doesn’t mean he’s no longer a prospect but it is nice to have a “fresh” looking list without a lot of the same old names. There isn’t much debate where a guy like Wieters would go, or even a guy like McCutchen. I think it’s more interesting to see those last 10-15 names that get added by removing players with MLB experience, because it’s that range where real debate could go on.
RIP Nick Adenhart
by gatling on
Jul 6, 2025 10:00 PM EDT
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Thanks
Who do you see in the 40-50 range? For me I’m not that high on the guys 47-51.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 6, 2025 11:52 PM EDT
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Off the top of my head
Moustakas, Hellickson, Jay Jackson are some names that come to mind that could be slotted in the last few without too much trouble I don’t think. Todd Frazier, Carrasco, maybe Revere and/or Hicks, and probably another 5-8 guys I’m overlooking could all fall in the 40-50 range and the list would still be fine. Really comes down to what you like I think, but this is a very good list as is. There a few guys I need to take a second look at now after seeing your list though, that’s for sure. That’s what I like about this kind of stuff, it gives you a chance to go back and learn more about guys you might have looked over.
RIP Nick Adenhart
by gatling on
Jul 7, 2025 3:28 PM EDT
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Is Thomas Neal really that old for A+ ball?
he’s only 21.
by zeisenbe on
Jul 6, 2025 10:01 PM EDT
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I think so
For a top prospect in his 4th minor league season, yes it is too old. For a college player to start there at 21, that cool. I want to see the Giants be more aggressive with him.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 10:34 AM EDT
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Respectfully disagree
Neal is right on track. Typical (i.e. non-first rounder) high school player ages/levels:
18: GCL/AZL
19: High Rookie/A-
20: Low-A
21: High-A
22: AA
23: AAA
If Neal is old for A+, then Norris, Barnese, and Moore is old for A at 20. Jennings and Taylor, would be old for AA at 22.
The average age in the Cal League is almost 23 this year.
by aCone419 on
Jul 8, 2025 10:35 AM EDT
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Misleading average
If you take out players that are filler/non-prospects, the average age of players who are actually expected to progress through the minors and possibly make the bigs, is much lower.
by slurve on
Jul 8, 2025 11:21 AM EDT
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Re:Neal
Again, I am a proponent of aggressive testing of players. While I like when they spend the year at a single level, I think he needs to be in AA soon.
Agree to disagree.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 8, 2025 11:37 AM EDT
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Pablo Sandoval
Was repeating A+ last year for half a season. He then went to AA a quarter season. he then ws in the bigs a quarter season. Now, at 22, he is an all-star, for whatever that’s worth.
The Giants are interesting these days with prospects. Alderson repeating high A after excelling very young last year, but I think that was due to Connecticut cold in Spring. Bumgarner starts in high A, also goes right to AA.
Neal will almost certainly be in Connecticut this year. Can he pull a Sandoval?
Anyway, you have him at 47. i don’t believe anyone else on the site who has posted their top 50 recently has him in the top 50. Unless I missed, not in project prospect 50, gore’s braves, freedy, is it gobak?
by wobatus on
Jul 8, 2025 1:31 PM EDT
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Yeah
I think he will be in AA. I think that is the best as well.
Not sure if you are agreeing or disagreeing lol.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 8, 2025 1:49 PM EDT
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Well
I agree he needs to be in AA soon and I think he will be. And, given how aggressive they were with sandoval after that, if Neal performs he could be up for a cup of coffee late. I wasn’t really agreeing or disagreeing overall, just adding information. Sandoval was 21 in high A, in double AA and in majors, all in sme year. I believe he truned 22 some time last August.
Not saying he’s identical, but another huge bust-out at 21 in high A San Jose for a guy not many highly toute previously, a good portion of it batting averge. Sandoval had a higher average, neal more eye and power.
by wobatus on
Jul 8, 2025 2:04 PM EDT
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I've got to say...
…I think Arrieta belongs above Drabek here. Arrieta has dominated AA and is pitching well in AAA, and doesn’t have Drabek’s injury history, and Drabek is only touching AA now.
I know Drabek has the curve, but I don’t see his stuff as that far ahead of Arrieta.
by James F on
Jul 6, 2025 10:57 PM EDT
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FYI
Me to Kevin Goldstein:
I had concerns about Arrieta’s slider and curve, has he tightened those pitches up this season?
Oh, and just because I had this conversation recently, how does Drabek compare to him? I give Drabek the slight edge due the perceived (by my accounts) better secondary stuff. Thanks KG.
His answer:
BP staff member Kevin Goldstein
I would give Drabek the edge as well. Arrietta secondary stuff is really just average, but the fastball is pretty special.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 2:49 PM EDT
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20-23
I don’t see that as a big difference, but on the bright side, I’m happy that most “complaints” are peanuts.
The difference is his secondary stuff vs. Arrieta, but again this is a close call.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 6, 2025 11:35 PM EDT
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This is a very good list IMHO
I have some quibbles, but theyre kind of petty ones… and everyone seems in the right neighborhood.
by alskor on
Jul 7, 2025 12:31 AM EDT
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just to pick your brain
what are you thoughts? Personally, I don’t care to much for the 5 v 8 spots but more about the rationale.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 12:33 AM EDT
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Ok, Ill give you a couple
- Montero. Not sure I like him that high. I do agree he’s one of the best bats in the minors, but so is Smoak, and he’s on the verge of reaching the majors… I see Montero as a 10-15 guy. He still need to show he can mash AA and up. I dont doubt for a second he will, but its not like there are no question marks. For instance, look at his walk totals. He’s not a patient hitter… I think he looks like an impact bat no matter what - but until he goes out and shows that he can hit upper minors (guys who know how to pitch) and shows a little more patience I think #2 is a bit high. He’s still a phenomenal prospect, but not quite #2 for me.
- I like Feliz more than that. A good bit more. I think Id have him as a top 3/5 pitching prospect. Regardless of anything else, the kid has crazy good stuff. Ive learned to stop worrying and not bet against stuff like that. I had him that high to begin with…
- I still like Hosmer a lot.
- I thought I was a huge Michael Saunders fan… youve got me beat. I cant see him quite that high. I like Jennings more than him, too.
- I like Brandon Snyder, but Im not sold on him as a top 50 guy… have to think about that some more.
-RE: Beckham, Hosmer. A point Ive been meaning to make for awhile now… when a guy gets drafted we have no problem seeing who he is in our mind’s eye and going completely on scouting reports (and unreliable numbers)… Saying Tim Beckham las year was a top 20 prospect… not many had a problem with that even though we didn’t have any performance to back it up.
We also know many stars who struggled at different levels in the minors and seeing they had bad debuts or bad years in the low minors doesnt surprise us at all. Yet, for someone like Hosmer or Beckham we seem to get too focused on performance and forget that it wasnt performance but instead tools that made our initial impression of them. IMHO, if Tim Beckham’s tools were enough to make him a top 20 prospect for me six months ago then he probably still should be a top 20 guy now. There just isnt much that he can do at this stage of the minors to change my opinion of him. His tools havent changed.
We’re all vulnerable to this, but the bottom line is that we know we arent going to put that much weight on his low A performance in two years, so why let it drastically swing his prospect status now?
by alskor on
Jul 7, 2025 1:14 AM EDT
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+1
Also, I think you forgot LaPorta.
In general, I’m not sure why people are rating Smoak quite so high - he has gaudy stats this year, but his power has not been especially impressive for a 1B. LaPorta, for example, seems to be a better prospect than Smoak, even once defense is considered
TheSouthWing.com - A Magazine of essays, prose and poems
by OldProspects on
Jul 7, 2025 1:46 AM EDT
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Montero vs. Smoak
Smoak had a .930 OPS at AA at age 22. Montero has a .906 OPS at AA at age 19, while playing catcher full-time. While Smoak has done it in a larger sample, I think Montero has proven that he is capable of mashing in AA, and it’s not like Smoak has set the world on fire since being promoted to AAA.
http://www.theyankeeuniverse.com
by lemonjello on
Jul 7, 2025 1:50 AM EDT
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To get that .930 OPS
he needed a .388 BABIP. His plate control is quite impressive, but it’s ultimately hard to imagine a top-tier 1B without significantly higher power numbers. Not to compare them, but Daric Barton had a higher ISOP in AA at age 19 than Smoak has this year at 22 - and virtually identical walk and strikeout numbers
TheSouthWing.com - A Magazine of essays, prose and poems
by OldProspects on
Jul 7, 2025 1:53 AM EDT
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Smoak
I agree with you on him, but a plus defender at 1st with a good bat and a VERY high floor makes him where he is. There really aren’t many questions about him. I do question the pop. His lack of HR power is very apparent. His ISO is low, too low.
But—- His walk rate is ELITE.I can’t stress more how important that is.
The 150 ISO would make him (with three year data) the bottom ranking first baseman. I can see him in that range given the regression to his BABIP, improvements, Arlington, etc. I can see him maybe getting to the 175 range.
To me, he looks like the Todd Helton we’ve seen the past 3 years. Good walk and SO rates, solid power, good fielder.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 10:25 AM EDT
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Was Todd Helton a top-10 1B over the past few years?
I’m not saying Smoak isn’t a great prospect, or that he won’t be a great player, or even that his power won’t develop, but a guy who is highly likely to be a somewhat above-average player doesn’t sound like a top 6 prospect to me
TheSouthWing.com - A Magazine of essays, prose and poems
by OldProspects on
Jul 7, 2025 10:57 AM EDT
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Helton
Well, in 2007 Helton was a 5 win player, but over the last 2 he hasn’t been. The 3 year data is a combination of all of that. The 2008 2009 years could really be combine to make him a 3 win player over that span.
I think I see Smoak as a 3 -5 win player, and a pretty good probability of that. The lack of downside does play a good bit into the ranking, and a 3-5 win player is worth a very good amount.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 11:33 AM EDT
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Yeah, in like 3 games dude.
The 2009 Texas Rangers offense: sigh...
by Kinslerhomer on
Jul 7, 2025 10:12 AM EDT
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This is what Im talking about with my last point above
Scouting wise, there is every reason to believe Smoak will hit for plenty of power. The minor league statistics alone don’t concern me. Minor league numbers are predictive of future performance, but only when properly interpreted. There are many, many variables in minor league statistics. Parks are strange and in weird places. Defense is neglected and guys play out of position. Scoring and the way statistics are kept arent standard. It is necessary to view minor league statistics with a skeptical eye - and they must always be compared to scouting.
Smoak has been a very good offensive player so far. While Id like to see some more power, Smoak is showing an advanced approach and has great tools. The power will come. He’s a remarkable talent and should be in the consideration for #1 prospect, if you ask me.
by alskor on
Jul 7, 2025 2:05 AM EDT
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I also think that the oblique injuries
are one of the reasons for the lower power production so far.
The 2009 Texas Rangers offense: sigh...
by Kinslerhomer on
Jul 7, 2025 10:15 AM EDT
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Sure
But I still don’t think a 1B can be a top-5 prospect until he hits for some power in AA
TheSouthWing.com - A Magazine of essays, prose and poems
by OldProspects on
Jul 7, 2025 10:54 AM EDT
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So whats more of a concern?
Negatives
Smoak:
-Power, despite scouting reasons to think he will indeed hit for plenty of power
Montero
-Walk rate/Patience
-Defense, even at 1B
by alskor on
Jul 7, 2025 12:34 PM EDT
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Yeah
I do think I would amateur-ishly grade Montero’s power an 80 at any position, and Smoak’s a 55-60 (also against any position). I think that is a big difference at first.
I’m not sure about defense. Over the past 3 years there is a range of about 50 runs from Pujols (25.6) to Prince Fielder (-22.0). While Prince is an outlier, the next is more like (-10). We’ll stick with Prince though as an extreme.
Pujols is worth roughly 5 more wins a year than Price soley based on defense.
I think it is safe to assume that Smoak isn’t Albert Pujols, but from all reports we hear he is a plus defender. Lets make him Derrek Lee at +8.6 a top defense guy, but not the best one out there. A second tier defender behind Pujols and Youk.
Could Montero be the worst 1B in baseball? Yeah, he could. But he doesn’t seem to be that bad an athlete. I mean, he is playing catcher so he needs some flexibility, quickness, and mobility.
Lets put Montero in the second to last tier and make him Adrian Gonzalez at -7.0. That is a 15 run swing, or 1.5 wins working solely off assumptions. Even if we round that total to two (again, off assumptions) I think Montero’s bat would make up for it. And if you assume Smoak’s defense is Lee, and Montero is a DH, we are looking at 1.5 wins too.
While that doesn’t make one better than another, it makes them different. But i’ll go with Montero.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 1:41 PM EDT
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LaPorta had MLB abs
I agree about Smoak’s power, which is why I have Montero in front of him.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 10:11 AM EDT
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I did not read that as At-bats
But rather as abs. I hear Gabe Kapler has MLB abs as well
The Dodgers won't win a playoff series until the Cool-a-Coo returns.
by mckeeno on
Jul 8, 2025 2:25 PM EDT
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Montero
At 19, I see progress in his walk rate thus far. If he does wind up at around 5% that is certainly a problem. One of the things I do believe, is when someone mashes as much as him it tends to lower their walk rate. I know that is counter intuitive because pitchers want to pitch around them. However, when you hit everything there is less incentive to walk.
I like Feliz, and I don’t think where I have him is a slight by any means. But I do have concerns about his secondary stuff at higher levels. Only time will tell, but I haven’t heard enough to make him push him into the top of the first tier, he is more in the middle for me.
Beckham and Hosmer— I actually HATE that we rank people with no professional experience. All the stuff we hear is pretty much second or third hand and have no real idea of what kind of hitter they are. I never was in favor of ranking them before experience. IMO, they get more leeway for their pedigree, but I like to wait for stats before making any judgement based on hyperbole. The tools are extremely important, and that is why Beckham is there still. I don’t think top 50 is a slight, even at the back end. Especially for a HS talent. Hosmer, though, as a 1B you really need to be able to mash, and I just need more from him. Again, top 100 isn’t bad, he is in the top 1%.
Snyder- I might not disagree with you, but from all account he has been pretty dominate this season.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 10:19 AM EDT
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Very good list,
The only issue is that I see Jennings 10-15 spots higher. I prefer Jennings level of talent to be better than Flowers, Saunders, Brown, Taylor, and Gordon (in no specific order). I believe he’ll outshine all of them. The injury issue I think was largely blown up IMO. I think he’ll be fine as he continues to show the ability to make adjustments and grows as a player. He may never hit more than 25 hr in the MLB, but he has shown the possibility to be a similar player to Upton/Crawford while playing better defense than both (also my opinion). I just believe that he should be slotted in the 20th spot overall…
"When Justin Upton faces Lincecum, I think Christ might appear in the heavens, and the world will end." -JakeFree
by JT12340 on
Jul 7, 2025 5:27 AM EDT
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My observations
Overall, a great list Metty! Probably the best one I have seen posted on this site thus far.
I too like Jennings a lot more than you do. His injuries thus far have been more fluky in nature rather than something that could/will be recurring. I agree that the injuries are a concern, but you cannot argue with the tools and production when he has been on the field.
LOVE the ranking of Morrison. I see everyone dropping him into the 25-40 range due to the injury, but the fact of the matter is that is another injury that is unlikely to be recurring. He is still age-appropriate for his level, and I love the fact that his batting eye has stayed with him despite the layoff.
LOVE the ranking of Gordon. I am a little worried that he won’t be able to keep up the production as he moves up the ladder, but the skillset is real. I also think he has room to add a little power - just enough to keep the fielders and pitchers honest.
One guy I would like to see ranked in the bottom half of a top 50 is Todd Frazier. I know he’s been playing LF, but I still think he slots best at 3B. He has the glove and arm to play there defensively, and the bat has been stellar thus far in AA. The guy has been an absolute doubles machine, and I really believe those doubles will turn to HRs as he fills in a little more.
Great job sir!
by guru4u on
Jul 7, 2025 10:35 AM EDT
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Frazier and Jennings
The first two things that stand out are his age and consistency.
23 at AA isnt bad, but it isn’t a plus. I like him in AA for his fourth season. I like that his SO rate has plummeted this year, but sadly the walk rate has declined. I would like to see it jump up a few percentage points. Two other things stand out to me, his BABIP and his career IFFB%. IFFB% is a pretty nice indicator of some regression, however when your career number is 16% (at the very high end) and today you are at 20%, we can assume that will go down. The BABIP too, should drop from its current status, but maybe not as much due to the IFFB%.
Depending on where he is playing defensivly, he can be anywhere from 80-55 for me. If he is a plus defender in the OF that would put him around 55, if he isn’t i’ll probably be closer to 80.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 10:54 AM EDT
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Fair points
I would say a 37:28 K:BB rate is pretty darn good. Yeah, the BB% could be higher, but to me the ratio is more important.
We can agree to disagree. After all, a difference of #45 vs. #65 really isn’t that big.
by guru4u on
Jul 7, 2025 11:07 AM EDT
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Ratio vs. %
Yeah I actually think those are two big differences.
The run expectancy for each even can be found here (Tango is so much smarter than almost anyone I know lol). of a walk is 0.303 and a strike out is -0.269 compared to a normal out of -0.265.
Ratio is important because the more walks you have over strike outs will keep you with a positive run expectancy added. However, a strikeout’s difference to a normal out isn’t much at all, while it isn’t safe to assume if one wasn’t going to strike out, they were going to get out anyway, it is safe to assume that walking automatically means one can’t get cause an out.
The more walks you have, the less chance you have at causing an out for your team. So while, ratio is important, IMO, the higher percentage of PA that you walk, the more valuable you are.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 11:46 AM EDT
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Is it me or isn’t LaPorta on this list at all? Why do so many people have him dropping out of the top 50 (or close to it)?
by JP_Frost on
Jul 7, 2025 10:46 AM EDT
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MLB ABs
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by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 10:46 AM EDT
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he has 42 AB’s, correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t the rookie cut off at 130?
by JP_Frost on
Jul 7, 2025 10:49 AM EDT
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I made the same mistake
He made the cut-off any at-bats or innings pitched
TheSouthWing.com - A Magazine of essays, prose and poems
by OldProspects on
Jul 7, 2025 10:55 AM EDT
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yeh, your rigth
I omitted anyone with a MLB PA. Second sentence. ;-)
Top 50 Prospects with NO MLB experience. I figured I’d get into the action.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 10:55 AM EDT
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Why complain about LaPorta??
Why not hit him with Wieters or Price instead? If you are going to fail to read his disclosure that he did not rank anyone that has MLB experience, why complain about the 8th best option?
by guru4u on
Jul 7, 2025 11:04 AM EDT
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because he is an indians fan lol
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 11:33 AM EDT
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Yeah i have seen laporta drop on alot of lists
by Heyward is the next crime dog on
Jul 7, 2025 11:43 PM EDT
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nice list
may be closest to my own, although some guys I am not as up on. But from the rest of the list I can see that our overall take is likely similar. I can see some folks questioned Alvarez that high, and i would as well. I saw someone else had Carrasco at 13 and your list skips him, that is closer to my take. I haven’t gotten around to my top 50 completely. Still going over it in my mind and I like to see others first and read their takes.
Does Logan Forsyth make your top 100?
by wobatus on
Jul 7, 2025 12:19 PM EDT
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Absolutely-
Who were you not as high on?
I like Forsyth a lot. I don’t know much about him defensively, so I’d love more info there. His A+ ball numbers are great. Its a similar situation to Neal, where I’d like to see how he finished up AA this season before moving him into the top 50. I’d have him around 60-70 though depending on his defense.
Obviously, I’m kind of a walk rate whore, and he is great there. I would like to see the strike outs disappear, but as I’ve said before they don’t bother me much.
His big factor that would move him in the 50 range is his ISO in AA. If he can be around 150 to his A+ ball numbers I’d be excited. If he drops to 110 like his A- numbers, then I’d like to see more power develop for a 3b.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 1:25 PM EDT
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Not sure yet
Alvarez, and although i am a Mets fan, maybe Holt lower. Don’t know much about Helsey for example.
by wobatus on
Jul 7, 2025 1:54 PM EDT
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You seem to really underrate the Rays prospects.
Jennings and Davis are pretty low, but I’d say you completely missed the boat on a 19 YO hitting far above average while playing SS.
by rglass44 on
Jul 7, 2025 12:28 PM EDT
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underrate them?
he doesn’t rank jennings or Davis much lower than, say, the project prospect dudes (whatever your take on that list), and unlike them he ranked Moore and Barnese, and he ranked beckham almost same as them. Not that those are representative lists, but those aren’t necessarily outrageous ranks for the rays guys.
by wobatus on
Jul 7, 2025 1:04 PM EDT
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lol
First, don’t be a jackass. I’ve been pretty calm while answering all questions, don’t make accusations without letting me respond to an initial point. I haven’t belittled a single person.
Beckham — How is he hitting far about average? He has a 337 wOBA which is above replacement level, but certainly below “average”. His walk rate is unimpressive, his k rate is bad, and he has an ehhh ISO. Not to mention the numbers he is currently putting up are linked to a high BABIP. He is a TOP 50 prospect in all of baseball, top 1% of all minor leaguers.
How am I underrating Rays prospects? There are four on the list. Moore, Barnese, Davis, and Jennings. I’m pretty sure I’m the only person who has even mentioned Davis lately (or one of the few), and I’m certainly the only one to mention Barnese or Moore that high.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 1:20 PM EDT
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re: beckham
He has a 111 wOBA+ how is that below average?
by bigboy1234 on
Jul 7, 2025 3:55 PM EDT
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wOBA+
I would love a copy of the spreadsheet you made, or the link to the website that calculated that.
I know of two sites that accurately update wOBA, Fangraphs and First Inning. But none that do wOBA+ adjusted to league, park, all-time.
While I doubt doubt it, it seems unlikely given how much the minor leagues shit around that an adjusted data would be useful, but I’d love to see it.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 4:19 PM EDT
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found it
I still believe, that wOBA+ probably isn’t a great metric for minor leaguers, but I could be convinced otherwise.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 4:33 PM EDT
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You are the one that brought wOBA up and saying that his was below average. I was just stating the fact that you were wrong. I never said it was great for evualating minor leaguers, although it isn’t awful obviously.
by bigboy1234 on
Jul 7, 2025 5:41 PM EDT
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yeah
your right, I actually screwed up on wOBA too above. It can be helpful, my biggest issue though is the amount of leagues. And while it normalizes for the league average(obviously we’ve sen that much LOL) I’m not sure how great it puts the big picture into perspective.
Maybe it helps more so, because you don’t have a raw number anymore. I’ll try and play around with it more and try to see how I feel about it.
You were certainly right though, I was definitely off with the league average aspect.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 6:11 PM EDT
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and I should note
Below the average for a top prospect SS. It probably is around the league average in general.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 4:21 PM EDT
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I would love to see that spreadsheet that you made saying that it’s below the average for a top prospect SS.
And we already established it’s above league average. It’s ok to admit you are a little off sometimes, everyone makes mistakes, quit digging.
by bigboy1234 on
Jul 7, 2025 5:44 PM EDT
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Didn't see this one
I wasn’t intending on being rude to you. I was asking if you had one lol. I hadn’t heard of wOBA+.
And I obviously make mistakes. I’m not trying to be defensive and as I stated again below, I stand by the overall jist of my argument. I certainly glanced to quickly and made a conclusion based on a perception rather than an actual number. You called me out as you should and it adds to the discussion.
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by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 6:14 PM EDT
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Don't be a jackass?
WTF are you talking about? I made a criticsm. I ignored Moore and Barnese because I felt you rated them higher than I would have.
Going into the season most had Davis as a top 30-40 prospect. With graduations, that bumps him at least 10 slots. You DROPPED him, even though he has performed very well at AAA.
Regarding Beckham, along with the wOBA figure below that proves he’s above average, he also has a .761 OPS that is a bit higher than league average .688. I have no idea what alternate universe he’s below average so quit being a sensitive “jackass” (your word not mine). His peripheral stats are getting better as he adjust, and SHOCKER he has ARL on his side so the stats should be taken with a grain of salt.
by rglass44 on
Jul 7, 2025 5:39 PM EDT
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Beckhem vs. ????
Lawrie- 115 wOBA+ not a SS
Pedro Alvarez- 108 wOBA not a SS
Anderson- 104 wOBA+ not a SS
Gordon- 109
Shall I keep going?
by rglass44 on
Jul 7, 2025 5:59 PM EDT
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Ok
Your criticism generalizes the ranking of Rays prospects while ignoring two of them on the list. That seems a little unreasonable, no?
I’m certainly being nothing but respectful to everyone, you seem to be the one getting testy.
I still fail to see how how Beckham being rated a top 50 prospect is a bad thing? Is there a difference between 50 and 30? Sure, but in my opinion its marginal at best, maybe your opinion differs and you have every right to that.
Your next post which just popped up is great. Except that every prospect is different and in different leagues. Lynchburg is CAL, Wisco is MIDW.
Is Beckham’s rate above league average yes. I was mistaken. I’ve been at work and responding to tons of comments. However, I stand by my critic of Beckham’s stats. I would like to see more from him. I thought I was on point where he was, agree to disagree. I think even with his current stats, he is due for some BABIP regression. I’d like to see more. More walks, less SO, slightly more pop.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 6:07 PM EDT
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I’m certainly being nothing but respectful to everyone, you seem to be the one getting testy.
You called me a jackass for saying I thought you missed the boat on a prospect, how did I get testy?
Regardless, those are wOBA+ that are supposed to control for league and stadium. As you can see his bat is in line with players mentioned, and he projects to be a plus defender at SS.
The guy doesn’t go from Barry Larkin comps to barely top 50 in one season where he performs better than average in a league where he is younger than average.
I wasn’t trying to be rude or pick a fight, my point was Beckham has been very good if you delve into his numbers AND consider the tools that got him drafted 1 overall. He’s obviously a work in progress, but to rate him so far behind guys like Gordon, Lawrie, etc seems strange.
by rglass44 on
Jul 7, 2025 6:22 PM EDT
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Just to be clear here, wOBA+ for minor leaguers does not include a park adjustment. Now you could do it manually by grabbing Dan Szym’s PF off BTF, but that is a decent amount of work to keep going live unless you are a pretty good computer guy. Regardless wOBA+ even without the park adjustment is a lot better than just looking at raw wOBA.
by bigboy1234 on
Jul 7, 2025 6:31 PM EDT
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Park Adustments
Yeah that was what I realized that I said I messed up earlier.
rglass44, I’m sorry if I perceived your comment differently than it was intended, that wasn’t my goal (obviously). I hade a really pissy e-mail at work, and I might have read what I wanted to read.
And again, sorry.
Beckham — I don’t see the correlation yet to “peak” Larkin. I think it could be achieved with, again, a doubled walk rate, and the cutting down of his SO. I think the SO will be a natural decline. I see that being a product of youth, right now. It’ll be interesting to see if it persists. Obviously its a different era (and again, SO don’t bother me) but Larkin’s career SO% was 10. And his BB% started out awful, his peak years he was outstanding (which leads to a lower than expected career rate). Also, like I said before, to get to Larkin status his pop is going to need to increase.
My question is, if what are your expectations for a top SS prospect? Lets assume he is a plus defender. 300 wOBA? wOBA of 350? For me, I’d like to see him in the 360 range. I do think it is possible, but he’ll need his numbers to reflect those adjustments.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
by Metty5 on
Jul 7, 2025 6:43 PM EDT
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A few things:
Don’t worry about it. I don’t take anything too seriously because the give and take can be fun and sometimes misread.
One thing to remember with Beckham: he didn’t play the greatest competition in HS, and they had to completely rework his swing. His hands are quick and his wrists are strong, so in HS he was able to get by with a TERRIBLE swing. Supposedly its been fixed.
As the season has gone on he has improved. He is in a mini-slump now, but since May 20 his wOBA is roughly (I used the basic calc.) .349 (OPS of .790). While I would like to see that K:BB ratio get better, I would expect that to come with age.
What do I want to see from him? I’d like to see him continue to improve as the year goes along. I’d like to see a wOBA or OPS above league average, and I’d like to see a greater disparity as time goes by. A lot of it depends on his defense. Granted he’s had error troubles, but most kids to at that level. The encouraging thing is the reports on his range and arm. If he ends the year with a wOBA of .350, then I’d be very happy. That would probably put him at a wOBA+ of 120 or higher. He has ARL on his side and he has defense and position, if the bat carries at each league and he adds power I have no problem with what he’s done thus far.
I just get frustrated when people compare what he’s doing with what Posey, Smoak, et al. are doing. The kid was raw when they drafted him. He’s still raw, so you can’t just look at his numbers and say he’s not as good a prospect.
/rant over
by rglass44 on
Jul 8, 2025 11:31 AM EDT
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Best list so far
good job..at least your picks are defensible and its seems like you applied the same logic to every player in how you rated them, unlike some other people who have made lists ( i am not naming names).
by jsmall404 on
Jul 7, 2025 5:01 PM EDT
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love the #1 choice
by Heyward is the next crime dog on
Jul 7, 2025 11:41 PM EDT
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Great job
this takes a lot of effort
There’s a good crop of minor leaguers this year — i thought the pool would be waning thin with all the promotions.
by METSMETSMETS on
Jul 7, 2025 11:54 PM EDT
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of course
the big omission on all the lists is Rzepczynski. :)
He’ll never make a top 100, since he’ll go from non-entity to non-eligible. :)
by wobatus on
Jul 8, 2025 8:15 AM EDT
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