Community Positional Prospect #6
by auclairkeithbc on Nov 10, 2011 10:10 PM EST
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PrintWith 45.1% of the vote, Devin Mesoraco is elected Community Positional Prospect #5.
RESULTS:
Devin Mesoraco: 45.1%
Jesus Montero: 26.8%
Will Myers: 15.9%
Anthony Rendon: 6.1%
Nolan Arenado: 3.7%
Xander Bogaerts: 1.2%
Oscar Taveras: 1.2%
Hak-Ju Lee: 0%
Jake Marisnick: 0%
Anthony Rizzo: 0%
CANDIDATES: Jesus Montero, Will Myers, Anthony Rendon, Nolan Arenado, Xander Bogaerts, Oscar Taveres, Travis D'Arnaud, Bubba Starling, Yonder Alonso, Nick Franklin
IN ROTATION: Miguel Sano (#4-0%), Francisco Lindor (#4-0%), Hak-Ju Lee (#5-0%), Jake Marisnick (#5-0%), Anthony Rizzo (#5-0%)
TESTERS: Yasmani Grandal, Cheslor Cuthbert, Brett Jackson, George Springer, Anthony Gose
#01 - BRYCE HARPER - 59.2%
#02 - MIKE TROUT - 38.8% (In Poll #1)
#03 - JURICKSON PROFAR - 52.9%
#04 - MANNY MACHADO - 31.5% (55.1% In Runoff)
#05 - DEVIN MESORACO - 45.1%
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+1
Read Me At: Twitter/Blog/MLBBonusBaby /Giants Nirvana
by Gobroks on Nov 10, 2011 10:44 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
+1
Minor League Ball's 2010 Rookie of the Year Poster
If you didn't know by now, my screen name is sarcastic
by mathisrocks5 on Nov 10, 2011 10:51 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
+1
"We did a lot of good things last year, and now we've got Julio ... That does nothing but improve the offense, and we expect to do better. That's our goal, to lead the NFL in everything. Every offensive category." -Roddy White
+1
The 2008 Rogelio Moret League Fantasy Baseball Champions!
by The Congo Hammer on Nov 11, 2011 3:33 PM EST up reply actions
+1
Da'Sean Butler - A Mountaineer Legend
by McCutchenIsTheTruth on Nov 10, 2011 10:35 PM EST up reply actions
+1
Yoenis Cespedes
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=15469
^ the bottom video ^
by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Nov 11, 2011 12:42 AM EST up reply actions
+1
Just don't piss her off, otherwise she'll get all Dien Bien Phu up in your Boxer Rebellion - caknuck
btho Iowa State
+1
"If you find a man or woman who sticks around after you tell them "I may be a demented horse, but I know CPR," you marry them. No questions asked." - kishi
by CaptainCanuck on Nov 10, 2011 10:35 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Other tester ideas
Beyond those on the poll, in rotation or on the tester list the next ten names I have are Garin Cecchini, Starling Marte, Tim Wheeler, Gary Brown, Will Middlebrooks, Derek Norris, Aaron Hicks, Kolten Wong, Matt Szczur, and Jedd Gyorko.
http://bullpenbanter.com
RIP Randy "Macho Man" Savage
Cecchini
I find him intriguing. In that group of highly-rated new pros who we must rate based on scouting and pedigree…but in his case, he’s a bit old already and then further hampered by injury delays. I worry that he’d have to be substantially better than guys like Cowart, Castellanos, et al. to stay on par with them. Thoughts on this?
Cowart probably has the most raw power, but also probably the least in-game power at this point and maybe the biggest issues with plate discipline. He’s still a few years off I think, he hasn’t gotten out of Rookie Ball yet so Cecchini being a year older ends up a wash for me there. Castellanos has played against the best competition of the three and did very well there, but he has the biggest question mark regarding his defense and has some K issues of his own. I think it’s safe to say that Cecchini projects to be the best defender of those three, and his hit tool is on par with Castellanos. Obviously he has to be healthy next year, but I think he could really break out in a big way.
http://bullpenbanter.com
RIP Randy "Macho Man" Savage
Fair enough
I’m singling out Cecchini here because I keep moving him down my list as I think further, and because I usually agree with your placements. In this case, I kept thinking Cecchini was near the top of that cohort (more than just Cowart and Castellanos, it’s pretty much all high-profile 2010 HS draftees), but all the secondary considerations keep adding uncertainty. Will that primary factor (talent) be enough to offset the secondaries? I think I’ll be targeting several others from that cohort first.
I was sort of the opposite
the more I looked at Cecchini and Castellanos, the higher up my list Cecchini went and the further down Castellanos went from my original placement of him. The injuries don’t seem to be a long term issue, and I think if you ding him for both the injuries and the age it’s sort of double dipping so to speak. Would it be that surprising to see him finish 2012 in High A if he’s healthy all year? That would put him on the same track as Castellanos likely(though with the Tigers aggressive promotions that is hard to call for sure) and probably ahead of Cowart(based on his issues with the strikezone I don’t see him jumping two levels next year).
http://bullpenbanter.com
RIP Randy "Macho Man" Savage
Cecchini turns 21 in April 2012
Yeah, it’d be nice to see him get to A+ next year.
Sure
but if he spent the whole year in the Sally it’s not like it would destroy his prospect status. With Middlebrooks and potentially Bogaerts ahead of him on the depth chart, there isn’t any reason for Boston to push too hard and he’d still be on a solid track age wise really.
http://bullpenbanter.com
RIP Randy "Macho Man" Savage
Olt
Injury caused some missed ABs, but a masher and excellent D at 3B. Crushing AFL.
He's already in the rotation
Even better than a tester!
by auclairkeithbc on Nov 11, 2011 1:14 PM EST up reply actions
I really like Franklin
Won’t be voted in here but I love his quick swing and the fact that he can do it from both sides is really nice. The power is great to see and definitely real in my eyes, the quick wrists make sure of that. What he could provide as a SS (I figure he will stay there) offensively could be great for the position.
Went Montero here
He’s been around so long I felt like I had prospect fatigue, so I went and looked his numbers up again. I wanted to coin flip between he and Myers, but in re-looking at the numbers, Montero has just been so solid…even at one year older and likely at 1B, that bat just looks basically unmissable.
Montero vs. Rendon
Sidd, I’m curious why you’re voting for Montero over Rendon. Are you down on Rendon because of the injury concerns? I think conservatively Rendon is going to have a 1.5 to 2 win advantage just in positional adjustment and defense. Do think Montero’s bat is going to be 15 to 20 runs better?
http://bullpenbanter.com
RIP Randy "Macho Man" Savage
It's not due to any quantitative exercise
It’s more the combination of two uncertainties about Rendon vs. Montero’s likely “high floor.” The two uncertainties being, of course, that we have yet to see his weaknesses tested against high level pitching, and that there remain some health issues that, if they linger, could cut into development time.
If Rendon sticks at 3B or 2B and hurdles AAA/MLB hitting with aplomb, then yeah, I’ll be wrong. But it’s a minor difference anyway, and today I feel like taking the more proven bat that might itself be dynamite.
Makes sense
as you mentioned above on Cecchini, we’re usually fairly similar in our rankings so two somewhat large differences showing up here in this thread surprised me a bit. I guess it still surprises me how far Rendon has fallen in the view of many. A year ago people were discussing him as a top 5 overall guy at worst and now with an injury issue we all have very little actual info about, he’s going to be the 7th best hitting prospect at best? Just seems odd to me as an overall occurrence, but I can totally understand your individual reasoning here.
http://bullpenbanter.com
RIP Randy "Macho Man" Savage
Luster slip
I suspect that Rendon has lost a little luster recently even among well-informed fans, perhaps more than he should have. But it would take a pretty perfect candidate to have no pro experience and yet surpass Montero, for me, and I just don’t think Rendon is quite that perfect right now.
Right now, I’m thinking my next ones are Myers, Rendon, and Arenado, then a grab bag from some combo that includes Marisnick, Bogaerts, Sano, D’Arnaud, and Cuthbert. But I’ll admit I am usually learning as I go this time of year, and these discussions sure help.
I'm not sure Montero's floor is that high
being a DH you have a -17.5 positional adjustment. add in 20 runs for replacement adjustment. Your at 2.5. I think Montero will have at least -2.5 baserunning runs, so lets give him 0, being generous, as Ryan Howard and Paul Konerko are at -10. So if Montero hits like Josh Hamilton this year, he’s an average major leaguer with 2 WAR. If he hits like Evan Longoria this year, he’s slightly above average with 2.5 WAR. To pass 4 WAR, he’d have to hit like Curtis Granderson this year, and Montero is not hitting 41 home runs. To pass 5 WAR he’d have to hit like Adrian Gonzalez or Prince Fielder this year.
From what Montero’s done, you definitely can’t project him to hit like Fielder or Gonzalez, not Granderson, and probably not Hamilton or Longoria. Myers playing RF alone is worth 10 runs or 1 win. If he can be a plus RF that’s even more. I would take Myers’s bat over Montero’s by a longshot because of plate discipline, so I really don’t think this is very close at all.
You're assuming Montero is a DH
And I’m not ready to do that.
Beyond that, I’m not ready to assume a few other things, including that he “is not” hitting 41 home runs. I don’t we’d have ever projected the HRs that Granderson and Ellsbury hit this year, either, and neither of them had the power of Montero back when they were that age. Someone among this current crop of prospects WILL hit 41 HR someday, and I’d say Montero’s a pretty good bet to be that guy.
I understand your points about Myers. He’s probably next on my list.
What you think he's a catcher?
with his awful 20% caught stealing rate. Okay, he could, but you don’t rate prospects on the possibility of a power outburst. So far, Montero hasn’t even hit that well. I could see Bryce Harper hitting 41 homers, not Montero. I couldn’t see Montero hitting like Longoria this year. I think he’s a DH and hitting worse than Evan Longoria this year won’t cut it as a DH for a top 10 prospect.
Cespedes
What do we have on him? Besides the fact that he’s 26 YO and has great tools?
Very good performance as well
Cuban record for homer’s this year, 33.
Power to the opposite field and, good hitting skills overall
Good enough batting eye, 49 BB -45 K’s this year
Good outfileder. Despite being a huge CF with that and his size making him more idea in Rf, he’s very solid out there.
I think even people who wanted to be negative about him would have to place him higher than Leonys Martin, whom he got on base as much as but, hasproduced way more power
" It's never just a game when you're winning" - George Carlin
I'm not going to be around till tomorrow evening
After 24 hours or so, or if Montero extends his lead by a bit, someone else please start the Positional Prospect #7 poll or if the race is within 2-3 votes (or whatever), start a runoff. I don’t care who does it. Whoever you drop from the list, you should probably add Sano and Lindor as they’ve had a couple rounds off already, then whoever you want from the tester pool.
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