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Around SBN: Kobe Bryant Will Never Top Michael Jordan

Unwarranted Interstate 35 Trade Speculation

I just made this up, but see if it makes sense to you.

It's late July. The Twins are doing okay, three games ahead of the Tigers, but they have a black hole at third base (at least offensively). No one is hitting there, and Danny Valencia is struggling at Triple-A and isn't the answer.

Meanwhile, in Kansas City, Alex Gordon is hitting a rather disappointing.254/.329/.432 but Alberto Callaspo is hitting .330/.385/.515. Chris Getz is also hitting well at second base, and no one is sure how to get both Gordon and Callaspo into the same lineup.

If you were the Royals, would you consider trading Gordon, thinking that Callaspo is the real answer at third base and that maybe Alex needs a change of scenery to get out from under the expectations in KC? If you were the Twins, would it make sense to go after Gordon?  

If it makes sense for both clubs, what would the trade package look like?

How about catching prospect Wilson Ramos, outfielder Joe Benson, and infielder Trevor Plouffe to KC in exchange for Gordon? Would that be overpaying, not paying enough, or just right?  

I'm not trying to start a rumor here: I'm just making this up. But does it make sense?

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Trade Speculation

I think the concept makes sense. I think that’s too much to pay for Gordon. I probably like Ramos more than I should since I know he needs to improve his plate discipline, but I think Ramos will have more value than Gordon over the next few years, so I think Ramos for Gordon even up would be enough, though KC would probably disagree.

by SChandler on Apr 20, 2010 3:31 PM EDT reply actions  

+1

"The best things in life aren't things; they're feelings"
-Anonymous

by eyerule12 on Apr 20, 2010 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Agree with SChandler

I think it’s too much as well. I think a gordon for Ramos swap straight up is a more then fair deal that if i’m the royals I would strongly consider, then they could maybe call up moustakas to play third. Ramos by midseason could probably step in and play catcher for them right away, and he is a better fit for the team considering they have a young moustakas who will be ready sometime soon.

My two cents

by srbaseball2003 on Apr 20, 2010 3:46 PM EDT reply actions  

Moustakas hasn’t even seen a pitch at AA and you are ready to call him up at the end of the year? More likely Aviles would be on the roster by then, Moustakas would stay at AA for the remainder of the year.

"I fight because I can’t sing, I can’t dance, and it beats working all day. Now ask me a question that doesn’t sound so fucking stupid." – Phil Baroni

by keyboardwarrior on Apr 20, 2010 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would give it a shot

why not :) KC has nothing else going for them….No, your right, I looked into that after I made that statement. Just seems like the guy has been around forever and it seems like he should have been ready by this year..But again your right, he is probably a year away at least.

They should take a shot at letting ankiel pitch again….now that would sell some tickets : )

by srbaseball2003 on Apr 20, 2010 6:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

Close, I think

Ramos may just be Miguel Olivo 2.0 . . . I like his arm, glove, hit tool and his power is good for the position, but he also seems to have horrendous plate discipline, and I don’t know if his bat is special enough to avoid getting carved up.

I’d think Ramos, Revere and Carlos Gutierrez for Gordon and Kila monster.

by gogotabata on Apr 20, 2010 3:49 PM EDT reply actions  

Intradivision Trade

I think that if the Royals simply thought that a change of scenery was all Gordon needed, they would not trade him to a team in their own division. So with that in mind, this would not make sense.

If I were the Twins and I thought that he actually had the same potential we all thought he did 3 years ago, I would do this in a hurry.

by ajake57 on Apr 20, 2010 3:54 PM EDT reply actions  

bingo

i’d probably pull the trigger to my temple if Gordon became a star with the Twins. god i hate the franchise so fucking much as it is.

baseball rules.

by doublestix on Apr 20, 2010 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

gogotabata

I see the concerns about the plate disc. But he is a good hitting catcher who is a top 50 to 60 prospect. To couple him with Revere who is another top 80-100 prospect and guiterez who the twins took rather high in the draft a couple years back and put up ok numbers would be too much. For one I like Kila and I don’t see any reason why he shouldn’t be up in KC, but the twins just flat out don’t need the guy, gordon is way overvalued in this comment but I understand why, he could put it together and bust out. But being a Twins fan I just couldn’t see them giving up that much for a perennial bust.

by srbaseball2003 on Apr 20, 2010 3:56 PM EDT reply actions  

+1

I actually mentioned a possibility of a Ramos for Gordon deal in an article I wrote a couple of weeks back. Seems like a decent enough deal since neither fan base likes it that much, though trading in the division is such a risk with young players. With Dayton Moore’s track record though, I don’t know that there is a package I’d be comfortable getting in exchange for Gordon. You’d almost guarantee Gordon becomes a superstar and whoever the Royals got in return would suffer a career ending injury.

http://bullpenbanter.com

by gatling on Apr 20, 2010 5:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

It's the Royals

All it would take is Alexi Casilla.

by ThomasG on Apr 20, 2010 4:07 PM EDT reply actions  

another possibility....

I know this is a little outside the thread, but maybe move ramos for Brandon Wood?? Just a thought, kind of a similiar highly touted 3bagger who has yet to do anything. Though i’m not sure the angels would do it because of the conga monga (conger) is in the waiting at C. Though conger isn’t the best defensive catcher meaning maybe they can co-exist in some fashion. Just a thought anyways. Maybe a change of scenary would be good for him as well.

by srbaseball2003 on Apr 20, 2010 4:17 PM EDT reply actions  

not quite

Not quite a good comparison…Gordon is a slightly above average player when healthy. Wood hasn’t been yet.

by John Sickels on Apr 20, 2010 4:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

well you got me there :)

At least Gordon has showed he can be a .245 15hr hitter when healthy…Though I would have to argue that Wood has not been given the chances that gordon has had up to this point. I was more so comparing Wood and Gordon as dominant minor league players who have yet to really have a above average year.

But I do get what your saying

by srbaseball2003 on Apr 20, 2010 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

well you got me there

:) At least Gordon has showed he can be a .245 15hr hitter when healthy…Though I would have to argue that Wood has not been given the chances that gordon has had up to this point. I was more so comparing Wood and Gordon as dominant minor league players who have yet to really have a above average year.

But I do get what your saying

by srbaseball2003 on Apr 20, 2010 4:43 PM EDT reply actions  

gordon

Gordon’s a .260, 15 homer, 35 doubles, 60 walk hitter when healthy, and I still think he could exceed that. Not great…but better than Nick Punto! lol

by John Sickels on Apr 20, 2010 5:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

haha

my buddy punto4mvp won’t like that. haha, ya, as much as I try to diminish Gordon’s value you seem to have me bested in every facet…..that is probably why you run this blog and I don’t :) Well lets just say this, if gordon gets traded to the twins i’m hoping for mvp seasons and a lot of balls pulled onto the plaza!!! And yes I realize thats one hell of a shot.

by srbaseball2003 on Apr 20, 2010 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

punto4mvp

Happy Birthday bud…..It wouldn’t be your bday without sickels mentioning something about your 2 favorite players….gordon and punto!!!!

by srbaseball2003 on Apr 20, 2010 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions  

thanks

I knew that this thread was my bday gift, considering I’m a huge Twins fan and a Gordon dynasty owner. Obviously if Gordon came to the Twins I would see less Punto, but then we could trade Harris and play Punto whenever Gordon needed a rest/was injured…

PPPPPPUNTO 4 MVP 2010

by punto4mvp on Apr 20, 2010 10:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

and Sickels

Thanks for backin Gordon, but not lovin the Punto hate…

You used to be my favorite sportswriter… :/

PPPPPPUNTO 4 MVP 2010

by punto4mvp on Apr 20, 2010 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

punto

He’s a great utility infielder, but miscast at 3B

by John Sickels on Apr 20, 2010 11:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

punto

With the Twins lineup what it is, the Twins are fine with hitting Punto in the 9 hole for his defensive prowess. We don’t need a slugger out of the 9 hole, we need a guy that has a high OBP who can work the count and who is good on the basepaths. Punto does all of these things. Obviously his bat has left more to be desired in the past, but Punto is a great #9 hitter for the Twins and his glove and speed more than justify his role on the team.

PPPPPPUNTO 4 MVP 2010

by punto4mvp on Apr 21, 2010 10:22 AM EDT up reply actions  

3 Points to make

1. To borrow a gambling term, the Royals are kind of pot committed with Gordon. They aren’t going to get back what they’ve paid and if he’s hitting poorly enough that they’re considering trading him away, then they will end up with 60 cents on the dollar and they’re in the position where they look like idiots if he succeeds elsewhere and idiots for not trading him early if he continues to scuffle. Sunks costs are sunk costs, but when you have the backstory of being the annointed franchise savior, it’s hard to cut ties for a trio of B/B- prospects.

2. I love Callaspo to death. I was an early proponent of him as a regular when they traded Buckner for him and criticized the organization for giving Grudzielanek another year when there really wasn’t anything to gain. HOWEVER, if he’s hitting .330 and slugging over .500, then he would be an example of sell high.

3. I’m not somebody to look down on trading within the division, but holy crap would it be traumatic for Royals fans to watch Gordon bat .270/.360/.525 behind Mauer-Morneau-Kubel-Cuddyer for the next half decade. That would be a real knife in the gut.

"Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it." - Mark Twain

by JM Barten on Apr 20, 2010 4:55 PM EDT reply actions  

Too much service time.

Valencia may very well scuffle, but the fact that he’s cheap is going to make him the third baseman of the future unless or until someone in the organization surpasses him. The Twins simply can’t afford to take on another player in the 2011 arbitration class, unless maybe it’s a right-handed reliever.

by timprov on Apr 20, 2010 5:32 PM EDT reply actions  

would love gordon in south florida the fish could use him in a heartbeat

by Fishfan79 on Apr 20, 2010 6:39 PM EDT reply actions  

But what's there to give up?

Some pitching? They could definitely use a stopgap until Dominguez is ready, because Cantu’s a nice hitter and all but he’s clearly inadequate defensively.

I like baseball.
I write for Beyond the Box Score and The Hardball Times Fantasy

by Satchel Price on Apr 21, 2010 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

I would have a hard time...

ever thinking that Callaspo is the answer at any position besides utility infielder, so from the Royals perspective for me trading Gordon and inserting Callaspo would not happen. However, if anyone would take one well above average season by Callaspo as a sign of things to come (and ignore his previous track record), I would definitely put my money on Dayton Moore.

by AKinn15 on Apr 20, 2010 10:10 PM EDT reply actions  

And yet he's already been dealt twice.

He’s pretty talented as a hitter, but he’s not good defensively and there are some possible character issues. But that guy can straight up hit.

I like baseball.
I write for Beyond the Box Score and The Hardball Times Fantasy

by Satchel Price on Apr 21, 2010 1:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Gordon to oakland for

Josh Donaldson, jemile weeks or adrian cardenas, OF Travis Buck, and SP Tyson Ross

by MagicMike23 on Apr 20, 2010 10:12 PM EDT reply actions  

What makes you prefer Weeks to Cardenas?

Cardenas has better numbers in Double-A, he’s only like nine months older even though he’s been around a lot longer, and he’s probably closer to the majors than Weeks.

I like baseball.
I write for Beyond the Box Score and The Hardball Times Fantasy

by Satchel Price on Apr 21, 2010 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Last thing the Twins need

is another left handed bat so they lose game after game to guys like Dana Eveland

"Ninety percent I'll spend on good times, women and Irish Whiskey. The other ten percent I'll probably waste."

by strums on Apr 21, 2010 12:12 AM EDT reply actions  

If I were KC

I would do that in a second.
Ramos for Gordon straight up may be a stretch to me. Plouffe has minimal value to me but Benson has some serious upside. I would be pissed if Bill Smith did that.

I wouldn’t mind a Wilson Ramos for Brandon Wood deal, although the Angels are pretty deep at C and probably wouldn’t be interested in that.

I think the Twins feel Punto’s D is so much better than others, they are happy to accept his poor hitting.

http://milbprospects.blogspot.com/

by Matt Garrioch on Apr 21, 2010 1:11 AM EDT reply actions  

I agree that Plouffe is nothing to get excited about

but Ramos and Benson are both pretty good prospects. There are at least a few people that I know of that expect Benson to break out on some level this season. He could end up being more highly touted than Revere soon.

I like baseball.
I write for Beyond the Box Score and The Hardball Times Fantasy

by Satchel Price on Apr 21, 2010 1:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

not a bad deal, but I think

its overpaying somewhat for Gordon. Ramos, Benson is probably enough at this point.

"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"

by feslenraster on Apr 21, 2010 8:24 AM EDT reply actions  

I think that Taylor is too valuable to give up for Gordon.

Would anyone trade six years of Wallace straight up to have Gordon through 2012? I sure as hell wouldn’t.

I like baseball.
I write for Beyond the Box Score and The Hardball Times Fantasy

by Satchel Price on Apr 21, 2010 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

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