Trying again as Mets GM
by BLieve on Dec 15, 2009 1:21 AM EST
Email
PrintAs the Mets GM I propose
John Maine, Kirk Nieuwenhuis, Reese Havens/Ruben Tejada, C+ pitcher for Carlos Zambrano.
Value wise is this fair? I think if John Maine was traded for a prospect(s), he would land 1 B- prospect or 2 C+ prospects, similar to what Matt Lindstrom landed the Marlins. Agree? Disagree with this?
So if you rank Kirk N, Havens and Tejada all as B- prospects, thats 3 B- and a C+ for Carlos Zambrano. Im ready to hear the hate folks.
23 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
The Cubs are a win now team
They can’t trade their best starter for guys who aren’t about to contribute.
True
+1
Check out my website, it has scouting reports for all the Orioles' top prospects and is updated daily. www.oriolesprospects.com
Follow me on twitter @orioleprospects and discuss the Orioles' prospects in my forums
by Jordan Tuwiner on Dec 15, 2009 3:41 AM EST up reply actions
along with that
some other comments:
a) Zambrano’s remaining contract isn’t that bad. It’s not great, but there’s only 3 guaranteed years at 53.75. If he really hits the player option, then keeping him in 2013 for 19.25 wouldn’t be that horrible (he needs to be 1st or 2nd for Cy Young in 2011, or top 4 in Cy Young for 2012 plus being healthy at year’s end). I guess what I’m saying is that I think, conceptually, that the contract isn’t that bad that I think a team would shoot for a B level guy instead of a B- level guy, or at least, get more ready help.
b) Specifically on the Cubs … the Cubs are still looking for another arm on top of Z/Dempster/Wells/Lilly (they’ll be fine with stopgaps until Lilly is healthy, but they are looking for one more arm).
c) Specifically on the Cubs II – Niewenhuis would have some intrigue for me, although it’d be tough to justify putting him in A+ ball again, and the rumors suggest Brett Jackson could be jumped to AA. That said, you could put them in the same OF in AA, or the Cubs could slow Brett Jackson’s rush and have Kirk in AA, Brett in A+. Havens or Tejada are intriguing, but with the Cubs middle infield depth, their value might not be as high for the Cubs. Can’t comment on the C+ pitcher without knowing who.
Zambrano's contract isn't "that bad?"
Define “that bad.” He’s getting paid at least 25% higher than he should be.
fair enough
i was trying to draw a very thin line that i didn’t do a good job with. It’s a bad contract, no doubt about it, but what I was trying to suggest was that, assuming he doesn’t collapse, that with 3 years remaining, it would be the type of deal where, hypothetically, a team would eat some money to get better quality in return.
why?
why do people propose stupid trades like this? this trade would never in a million years happen. zambrano is a complete stud on a team that is poised to win now. any GM in his right mind would hold on to a guy like that. and if he were to trade him away for what you’ve proposed, then he would most certainly be fired. just because you give some quantity doesn’t mean your deal is going to be accepted.
exactly
would be like the Rays trading Shields for some A ball guys…. would make zero sense for any team not in complete rebuilding mode
Contract differences
James Shields made 1.5 mil last year Zambrano over 17 mil.
"zambrano is a complete stud"
what planet are you on? Zambrano’s WAR the past 3 years – 2.8, 2.8, 3.6.
sure, that’s fine and all, but come on dude, he’s just not that great and he’s being overpaid to boot
Explain
Is it not fair or does the trade not make sense for the teams direction? Or both? Based on recent trades for pitchers I dont think the value is unfair. The Phillies traded two B prospects and 2 C+ prospects for Cliff Lee who is cheaper and better than Zambrano and they also got Ben Francisco in that package as well. So at best two B prospects and 1 C+ prospect for Cliff Lee.
I would say Peavy is most comparable in value to Zambrano. The Sox gave up 1 elite prospect with a grade of B+, 2 C+ prospects and an insignificant C prospect for Peavy. This is comparable to what I am offering.
And all these trades that have happened there were people that would have said they wouldnt happen in a million years.
but the team WONT win now
and he’s not the “stud” you think he is.
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 15, 2009 9:21 AM EST reply actions
with that said
shouldn’t the Cubs at least LISTEN to the offer?
by apoxonbothyourhouses on Dec 15, 2009 9:22 AM EST up reply actions
Mets fan make me want to punch myself in the face.
I just got on twitter.Follow me at http://twitter.com/JDSussman
I'll be trying to post lines and analysis as much as possible.
Remember: baseball guys... baseball...
+1
Check out my website, it has scouting reports for all the Orioles' top prospects and is updated daily. www.oriolesprospects.com
Follow me on twitter @orioleprospects and discuss the Orioles' prospects in my forums
by Jordan Tuwiner on Dec 15, 2009 12:37 PM EST up reply actions
In the NL, hitting counts
A lot of you are making a mistake in not considering what Zambrano adds with the bat. He’s the definition of a replacement hitter, while the average pitcher is approximately 0.1 WAR per 8 PA. Over the course of a full season, Zambrano adds roughly 1 extra win due to being one of the top few hitting pitchers. Calling him a “decent 2 or a good 3” is massively underrating him. A 3.5 – 4.5 WAR player - which is what he has been when you take offense into account — is a low-end ace or an extremely good 2.
If the Cubs traded him, it would be to help facilitate unloading Bradley, but it would need to be a win-now trade. Considering their need to contend and farm system, middle infield prospects are very nearly worthless to them. If you replace Niewenhuis, the middle infielders and the C+ pitcher with Pagan and an advanced B+/B prospect (Niese/Davis/Holt), I think the Cubs might consider it.
Not sure why it did the strikethrough
That should read: "while the average pitcher is approximately negative 0.1 WAR per 8 PA. Over the course of a full season, Zambrano adds roughly 1 extra win due to being one of the top few hitting pitchers. Calling him a “decent 2 or a good 3” is massively underrating him. A 3.5 – 4.5 WAR player, which is what he has been when you take offense into account, is a low-end ace or an extremely good 2."
by The Good Face on Dec 16, 2009 1:11 AM EST up reply actions
Good point
So his hitting is good enough that he adds one extra win a season by hitting once every 5 days? Zambrano is a good #2 starter currently. Calling him an ace would be 5 years late and calling him a #3 is an insult to him.
Cubs won't trade Z
Try Bronson Arroyo, Aaron Harang, Gil Meche or Paul Maholm.
Relive Royals History at royalsretro.blogspot.com
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
