Community Prospect List - Twins

by cwhitman412 on Oct 13, 2009 5:41 PM EDT Comment 33 comments

Last list of the AL Central. How about the NL West next? Fun systems there. 130 At bats, 50 IP limits.

1. Hicks

2. Gibson

3. Revere

4. Bromberg

5. Salcedo (He Looks really really good. plus no one else really stands out for me)

Ramos is very close at 6, but I preferred the upside. Guerra, Gutierrez, Bashore, Rams, Parmelee, Benson, Robertson, are a few of the others.

Anyone have reports on Pinto or Arcia? Those latin guys looked great from a stat perspective.

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1. Hicks
2. Sano
3. Revere
4. Gibson
5. guerra

by jarjets89 on Oct 13, 2009 5:46 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I'll take a stab at this

1. Hicks
2. Sano
3. Revere
4. Bromberg
5. Robertson – I don’t know why, to be honest. You could make a case for a number of guys as better options, probably, but I still like T Rob a tiny bit.

by toonsterwu on Oct 13, 2009 5:49 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

nvm, cwhit change mine to

1. Hicks
2. Sano
3. Revere
4. Bromberg
5. Ramos

by toonsterwu on Oct 13, 2009 7:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Twins

top 5

1. Aaron Hicks – OF
2. Kyle Gibson – SP
3. Wilson Ramos – C
4. Ben Revere – OF
5. Angel Morales – OF

H.M. : 6th Valencia -3B, 7th Miguel Angel Sano -SS?, 8th David Bromberg – SP
Chris Parmelee, Anthony Slama, Deolis Guerra, Michael McCardell, Alex Burnett

Deolis Guerra = Daniel Cabrera ?
I tend to think so

by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Oct 13, 2009 5:50 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

1. Hicks
2. Ramos
3. Morales
4. Revere
5. Gibson

I didn’t really like Gibson prior to the injury. He was a very good selection at the spot he was drafted, but I’m a bit skeptical.

by jar75 on Oct 13, 2009 5:59 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Same

His velo is so-so and he has shitty mechanics.

Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.

by Frederick0220 on Oct 13, 2009 8:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

twins top 5

1. Aaron Hicks
2. Kyle gibson
3. Miguel Angel Sano ( based on insane upside) yeah he’s a ways off
4. Wilson ramos
5. Ben Revere

by hotshotschamp on Oct 13, 2009 6:43 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I'd go...

Hicks
Revere
Ramos
Gibson
Sano

by joegonzo on Oct 13, 2009 6:53 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

1. Hicks
2. Revere
3. Ramos
4. Gibson
5. Sano

by AKinn15 on Oct 13, 2009 7:49 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

1. Hicks
2. Ramos
3.Bromberg
4. Gibson
5. Revere

Hard time with Sano…its a crap shoot..no ones ever seen him

by NYSOX on Oct 13, 2009 8:06 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I don't like this system...weak sauce.

1) Hick
2) Ramos
3) Gibson
4) Sano
5) Revere

Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.

by Frederick0220 on Oct 13, 2009 8:43 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

weak sauce

that top 5 is far from weak….

by hotshotschamp on Oct 13, 2009 9:08 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Hicks is the only

top 50 prospect in the system, and he didn’t even hit the year.

Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.

by Frederick0220 on Oct 13, 2009 11:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

well

Sano and Gibson are recent additions so of course they wont be on lists.

If you wanna go look back at prior so called top prospect lists most of them are laughable anyways.

I see Sano and Hicks with middle of order upside, hicks with plus defense.

Gibson that of a #2 pitcher
Ramos a starting caliber catcher with + defense, hit around .270 with some pop
Revere- .300 hitter, and shit disturber once he gets on the bases.

I’ll have to disagree, I think those guys in the top 5 , at least a few of them will have great MLB careers.

by hotshotschamp on Oct 14, 2009 2:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Also,

the problem with the Twins system is that their two big boppers (Hicks and Sano) have ridiculously low floors.

Then, you have a guy in Revere who has a decent floor, but no ceiling.

The only truly impressive pitching prospect, Gibson, has serious injury concerns, too.

Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.

by Frederick0220 on Oct 14, 2009 4:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I disagree, but to each his own.

To say Gibson is the only pitching prospect is just flat out dumb. The team has pitchers in the DSL, GCL, rookie ball, lower a, and up that could be good. Can you say this guy or that guy…no…..but pitchers are fickle, you should know that. How often do you hear about top end pitching prospects busting out, and some guys come out of nowhere ( nick blackburn) and had a very solid year, and post season for the twins whom was like a 28th rounder, so was brad radke.

I can name countless pitchers in the twins system that have big upsides in their lower levels pitching, as do most organizations, and I expect a few will make it.

Guy like Duensing was never on the so called pitching prospect radar but did very well as a starter for the Twins this year as well. Twins may not have a so called go to pitching prospect but they got plenty of guys who will pan out, no doubt, as they always do.

Also Hicks does not have a poor floor at all. He’s a very patient hitter, great eye at the plate, plays a great centerfield both with range and has a HUGE arm. Most every twins prospect, save a few have put up mediocre numbers with their stint in Beloit, expect a uptick next year.

And to say Sano has a low floor is pretty dumb as well, a team such as the twins don’t just toss around 3.15 mill lightly. Many who saw the kid said he’s as good as they have seen in recent memory from the DR. He’s a big kid for his age, with an explosive bat and good glove. I’m not sure why his floor is low, just because he hasn’t played professional ball doesn’t make your floor low. His floor and for that matter ceiling will be determined next year when he gets in the minors and faces real competition.

Hicks by no means has a low floor and Sano can’t be judged at the current time, and to do so is foolish, regarding his bust potential.

by hotshotschamp on Oct 14, 2009 6:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Also

The Twins core is from their system…

mauer
-morneau 3rd round pick
-kubel 12th round pick
-cuddyer
- Span

Basically their top 5 hitters and producers they have developed, and it’s been under the direction of Radcliffe and most of their current scouts. Their track record speaks for itself. People pretty much wrote off Span a, and said his upside nothing and he’d never amount to anything. He’s put together two very good + .300 seasons with a very patient approach at the plate.

I have no doubt some of these guys like hicks, morales, revere, benson, sano, parmalee, valencia and a few others will be impact major league players.

The Twins used rookies this year and AAA guys just about as much as any team in baseball, and still managed to make the playoffs and be 10 games over .500, with a payroll that is a joke. I trust the twins scouts and the people in charge doin their drafts and international signings, they have produced good results in the past 8 or so years with a very limited budget. It was great to see them spend big time money on the latin market this year ( sano 3.15 mill/ jorge polanco SS- 750 k. ) and also spend most money ever on European Max Kepler, 800 k, for a 5 tool 16 year old German, who we may hear about in 4 years. Twins are investing in their youth, and it will pay off down the line, and I for one like it!!!!!

by hotshotschamp on Oct 14, 2009 6:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It is by no means dumb....

to say that Sano has a very low floor. Players signed out of Latin America(especially the ones that get huge bonuses) tend to become busts. He may have very good potential, but odds are he doesn’t even make the major leagues. His floor is extremely low and we can judge that now.

Hicks also has a very low floor. He, like Sano, may have the raw tools to become a future all star, but tools only get you so far. He needs to perform, which is all that really matters when you come down to it.

Also, saying that Gibson is their only tuly impressive pitching prospect is not sumb either. He is their only pitching prospect that matters right now. Yea, they could have a couple of guys in the GCL or low a that could end up being good major league pitchers, but until they prove something, they aren’t really even that relevent. A good example for eeach of these situations is Ynoa. He has an amzing ceiling right now. He could end up one of the best pitchers in the major leagues one day, but he doesn’t even right now. He hasn’t proven anything and will likely be a bust. He was supposed to be one of the safest prospects sgined out of the DR and was signed for a record bonus by a very good talent evaluating organization that rarely throws out the large bonus. The thing is, is that his floor is so low that you can’t even that he will at least be a reliever. He likely won’t make it past Double A and neither will and most likely niether will Sano or any of the young pitchers in the GCL that have high ceilings.

by joegonzo on Oct 14, 2009 7:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah, haha,

Sano’s floor is about as low as they come.

The success rate for Latin American bonus babies is smaller than a primordial dwarf.

Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.

by Frederick0220 on Oct 14, 2009 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

awesome analysis

his floor is low because other bonus babies from their have flopped…….im not sure what another player in the past has to do with miguel angel sano.

Because I can list a ton of DR/VEN players that have went on to have HUGE careers… Lots of scouts have said he’s one of the best they have seen. I’ll take Twins scouts opinions over some monday morning qb on this site, who have actually seen the kid play. A small market team who doesn’t spend on their mlb roster, isn’t goin to fork over 3.15 mill for a kid with a insanely low floor, thats laughable.

Last big bonus baby the twins were interested in at such a young age and almost signed was a kid by the name of miguel cabrera, just about had him. Like I said ill take their due dillegence and scouting over a guy on a message board who knows nothing about him or has seen him play besides a 20 second clip

by hotshotschamp on Oct 14, 2009 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Miguel Cabrera?

That drunk?

j/k

Bottom line, this top 5 doesnt compare favorably to the other teams we’ve done so far. I dont have any strong feelings about the Twins, but to tell you the truth, you really seem to be the stereotypical fan who’s overrating his own team. The Twins always do a good job, but this crop isnt particularly appealing at this moment, as prospect rankings go, IMHO. It might look a whole lot different in a year, but as of right now, there are a lot of question marks about these guys and the lack of consensus about the top 5 on this page speaks to that.

by alskor on Oct 14, 2009 6:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I guess we'll wait and see

I like the top 6-7 guys in ( Hicks/Gibson/Sano/Ramos/Revere/Valencia/Bromberg) – I will say most of their top guys are a few years off and some will fizzle, but I think they got some great young talent that will help out a already young core on the big league team.

Time will tell, I’ve seen most of these kids play a few times live, and I think they will prove their worth in time.

by hotshotschamp on Oct 14, 2009 7:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

wow

by jar75 on Oct 14, 2009 7:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Wow, for every Miguel Cabrera

there are 10,000 failures who do nothing in the majors, if reach the majors, at all.

Past players are relevant in the discussion, because it tells you that the rate of success among Latin American bonus babies is profoundly low.

No one’s arguing the Twins’ scouting.

If they knew for sure that Sano would be a star in the majors, they would have shelled out $40 million.

There’s a reason why the best bonus babies only get $2-3 million — what Julio Lugo makes in the first 2 months of the season, and not more.

Sure, he might become a superstar, and he probably has the tools to do so.

However, in all likelihood, he will amount to nothing.

Sorry, hotshotschamp.

Truth hurts, buddy.

Brett Anderson is the Truth. Brett Anderson is divine presence. Brett Anderson is eternal life. Brett Anderson is within you. Brett Anderson is here. Brett Anderson is Now.

by Frederick0220 on Oct 14, 2009 8:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

you have nothing to be sorry for.

I’m quite elated my team took a chance on a kid with a enormous upside, and a kid many other teams wanted, and a kid scouts said has a huge upside and compared to longoria/arod/hanley.

If he fizzles he fizzles it happens, but they went out and spent real money on a kid who could be a impact bat, ill take that over the team who didn’t take the chance all day.

Also of course they didn’t spend 40 million on a 16 year old kid, but it was the highest ever paid out to a position player. 3.15 is equivalent to a #4-5 pick in the mlb draft or so.

Like any prospect they can fail, but given twins take their time with kids and have good coaching in their minors, he wont be rushed and will have time to make a bid for a major league career. Obviously he could fail, but he also could be a superstar, glad the twins stepped up to the plate, gives the fans hope. Sure kids like Sano/Kepler/Polanco our international bonus babies are 16 and we may never see them….but if 1 of the 3 makes it big its worth it. I like the twins commitment to winning here.

by hotshotschamp on Oct 14, 2009 9:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Sano

We have no idea what he is or even his real age. He received good scouting reports in May/June, but that’s all that we know. There’s a chance that he’s legit and will be a superstar, but the overwhelming odds are that he’ll fail. If I’m not mistaken these scouting reports are mostly from batting practice sessions, and he’s destined for the outfield. Add to all of this the fact that it took so long for a team to come close to his asking price, and I don’t see any reason to think more highly of him than someone like Gary Sanchez.

It’s a good signing for the Twins because this is an insignificant amount of money to an organization, but that’s all it is until we see him in the states.

by jar75 on Oct 14, 2009 8:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Question for everyone

(partially) since CWhitman didn’t mention 3B Danny Valencia anywhere (or Angel Morales)

what do you guys see Valencia doing or accomplishing in 2010?

Because if the Twins let him play 3rd full time I could see him putting up Aramis Ramirez type #’s with a little less power… maybe a .275/345/505 line?
joke
or no joke?

Deolis Guerra = Daniel Cabrera ?
I tend to think so

by SteveHoffmanSlowey on Oct 14, 2009 2:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

wait, Aramis Ramirez type numbers with less power?

also, whats’ the timeline?

I mean, Aramis has been one of the better players in baseball the last few years. Up until his injury riddled campaign last year, he had been a 4 or above WAR player since joining the Cubs in 2004, peaking in 2007 when he was an elite defensive player. He’s OPS’d above .898 each year since joining the Cubs, although I’m a bit concerned with the steady loss of power from Aramis (not worried relative to last year’s numbers, but just the overall trend).

Short of it is, expecting that from Valencia next year … well, while I wish him the best, I think the betting money, would uh, be against that. Could he be down the line? Perhaps, but while I like Valencia, I am not sure that is fair expectations for him. I still have some questions about his offensive consistency/potential to wonder if he can be, well, a consistent .850 OPS 3rd baseman.

by toonsterwu on Oct 14, 2009 3:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Forgot Valencia/Morales

I just go by quickly on BR, and sometimes I miss players. I probably would have put Morales 5. but Salcedo is close.

And I’m not a fan of Valencia.

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by cwhitman412 on Oct 14, 2009 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs