SALLY Top 20

by wobatus on Sep 24, 2008 12:16 PM EDT Comment 37 comments

Hmm, Noonan and Romine ahead of Freddie Freeman. Should spark some interesting discussion. Tougher positions to fill. Gindla and kalish towards bottom. Dominguez nice rank.

Taylor a little low for someone they named a minors all-star, but perhaps that is more pure stat driven, he is older, and and also he did well in Fla State league.

Mad Bum number 1. Chacin did better in high A, relatively.

http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/prospects/rankings/league-top-20-prospects/2008/266919.html

1. Madison Bumgarner, lhp, Augusta (Giants)
2. Jason Heyward, of, Rome (Braves)
3. Mike Stanton, of, Greensboro (Marlins)
4. Jhoulys Chacin, rhp, Asheville (Rockies)
5. Matt Dominguez, 3b, Greensboro (Marlins)
6. Angel Villalona, 1b, Augusta (Giants)
7. Jesus Montero, c, Charleston (Yankees)
8. Austin Romine, c, Charleston (Yankees)
9. Nick Noonan, 2b, Augusta (Giants)
10. Freddie Freeman, 1b, Rome (Braves)
11. Michael Burgess, of, Hagerstown (Nationals)
12. Che-Hsuan Lin, of, Greenville (Red Sox)
13. Cole Rohrbough, lhp, Rome (Braves)
14. Jeff Locke, lhp, Rome (Braves)
15. Michael Taylor, of, Lakewood (Phillies)
16. Alex Cobb, rhp, Columbus (Rays)
17. Darin Holcomb, 3b, Asheville (Rockies)
18. Caleb Gindl, of, West Virginia (Brewers)
19. Ryan Kalish, of, Greenville (Red Sox)
20. Cody Johnson, of, Rome (Braves)

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Comments

not bad

like the following:

1) rohrbough deserved a spot, even if his performance wasn’t lights out
2) locke is extremely under-rated in prospect circles – good to see him included
3) i like gindl’s upside

not wild about the following:

1) dominguez over villalona – he doesn’t come near his upside
2) cobb, holcomb, and johnson don’t impress me
3) i’d take heyward over bumgarner, but that is nit-picking

i did expect to see two of the yanks better pitching prospects on their somewhere – jairo heredia and dellin betances…….both have ace potential

by Wheelhouse on Sep 24, 2008 12:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Forget Jairo heredia,

the major omission from this list is Dellin Betances. He cracked 110 innings, K’d 135 hitters, and lowered that walk rate in the second half which is a significant indicator that the command improved. Even if the BA guys are still hung up on the overall BB rate, I dont know how Betances isn’t 11-15. Oh yea… he’s only 20.

by BxCitizen on Sep 24, 2008 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

+1

Jairo’s just another guy IMO.

Betances had a wild spell but he fixed his control by the end of the season. No excuse for him to not be here.

by number_twentyone on Sep 24, 2008 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Just another 18 year-old guy

who put up better numbers than #14 Locke and comparable numbers to #16 Cobb despite being 2 years younger than both of them. Heredia and Betances should both be on this list IMO. I am surprised that Romine was that high, but think that he definitely deserves to be on the list.

http://mvn.com/milb-yankees/

by lemonjello on Sep 24, 2008 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don't really care about age

look at the scouting reports. Jairo is young but that’s about it.

by number_twentyone on Sep 25, 2008 7:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

What scouting reports are you referring to?

Have there been any negative or unimpressive reports on Heredia?

http://mvn.com/milb-yankees/

by lemonjello on Sep 25, 2008 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm a Red Sox fan

and I think it’s a mistake to leave Betances off the list. I personally don’t feel that this list is all that great in general. I too would put Bumgarner behind Heyward.

Also Freddie Freeman would be higher, Burgess lower, Villalona a little lower, Holcomb wouldn’t be on the list, no Jon Lucroy, no Dominic Brown, and even Zach Britton I thought should have been on there.

by parnz on Sep 24, 2008 2:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

just another guy?

i don’t see many 18 year old guys putting up a 57% GB rate along with almost a K/IP and solid control at Low A……..comments like that and his omission from the list confirms for me that he is very under-rated right now……..he’s got the stats, the age, and the stuff – certainly adds up for me

by Wheelhouse on Sep 24, 2008 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'm a Yankee fan

and I don’t understand why he’s being hyped at all. I don’t think he’s among NY’s top 10 pitching prospects.

by number_twentyone on Sep 25, 2008 7:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

why is he being hyped?

low to mid 90’s FB with sink and late explosiveness
overhand power curve ball which he can consistently throw for strikes
developing change-up
plus command
solid mechanics

what exactly don’t you like about the guy? who are the 10 NY pitching prospects who are better then him?

by Wheelhouse on Sep 25, 2008 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Bumgarner

Here’s a paragraph or two from BA’s scouting report. It appears the concern for his secondary stuff is overblown a tad.

“He’s the most advanced pitcher I have ever seen at his age,” Augusta manager Andy Skeels said. “His makeup is impressive, and he has every physical tool you could hope to have. He’s the real deal, a true No. 1 starter at the major league level.”

Bumgarner works with a fastball that sits at 94-95 mph and an ever-improving breaking ball and changeup. He pounds both sides of the plate and changes the batter’s eye level with his ability to hit his spots with precision. He challenges hitters and exhibits a killer instinct on the mound.

I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?

by the pinstripes on Sep 24, 2008 1:16 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Bummergarner

I had a chance to draft him in my league but didn’t. I have some good minor league pitchers, but having lost out on parker, Porcello and price (cause I wasn’t following the prospect lists too carefully at the time), madbum may have been my best shot at a future ace. Although with Hollnad, Feliz, Chacin, Hanson and Alderson I ain’t exactly hurtin’.

by wobatus on Sep 24, 2008 1:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

What a stacked league

Say what you want about the rankings (I agree with several of the concerns raised here), but wow. Is this the best league for prospects?

by aap212 on Sep 24, 2008 1:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

It seems to me

like the SALLY often is.
Partly because guys are so young that they all seem to have high ceilings and there are some many recently highly drafted kids but also just because they SAL is a great league.

Y’all should find a way to go to a SALLY game sometime. Its great.

by nms on Sep 24, 2008 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think it is, though the Texas and Eastern league had plenty of prospects

by Bravesin07 on Sep 24, 2008 1:36 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Geez

Look at the top 10 from 2003 they had:

1. *B.J. Upton, ss, Charleston (Devil Rays)
2. *Scott Kazmir, lhp, Capital City (Mets)
3. *Cole Hamels, lhp, Lakewood (Phillies)
4. *Jeff Francoeur, of, Rome (Braves)
5. *Jeremy Hermida, of, Greensboro (Marlins)
6. *Hanley Ramirez, ss, Augusta (Red Sox)
7. *Fausto Carmona, rhp, Lake County (Indians)
8. *Merkin Valdez, rhp, Hagerstown (Giants)
9. *Scott Olson, lhp, Greensboro (Marlins)
10. *Mike Hinckley, lhp, Savannah (Expos)
*Has played in major leagues.

Now THAT was a stacked league. The top 7 is something else. They also had John Maine at 11, Matt Cain at 14, and Brian McCann at 20.

by aCone419 on Sep 24, 2008 1:44 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Zounds

by aap212 on Sep 24, 2008 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah that is sick

but Francouer and Hermida haven’t been as good as their scouting record.

by Bravesin07 on Sep 24, 2008 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Who cares?

I mean, obviously they’ve been disappointing, but for that list as a whole, to have successes like Upton, Kazmir, Hamels, Ramirez, Carmona, Cain, Maine, and McCann is phenomenal.

by aap212 on Sep 24, 2008 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I agree on that

by Bravesin07 on Sep 24, 2008 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

the amazing thing to me is that ALL of those guys have played in the majors. Its not often you see a 4 year old list of Low A prospects who all made it to the Show.

by yondaime4 on Sep 24, 2008 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

hermida

He screwed me over this year. I drafted him after his second half last year was sick (.340/.401/.555). But he has been mediocre most of the year, then dreadful last 2 months, slugging in the 240s in August and September.

And they have been benching him for Gonzalez for christ’s sake, although at least now they are out of it.

He had some issue coming out of spring training. Was it his wrist? But a remarkably poor season. Wilingham also regressed, not as much though and he had a real back problem.

by wobatus on Sep 24, 2008 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yikes

still don’t get big v over montero

by skiinginNJ on Sep 24, 2008 1:59 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

nor do i

i know people will discount this because i’m a yanks fan but that has nothing to do with it. if anything, i’m more critical of the yanks prospects than anyone else’s.

I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?

by the pinstripes on Sep 24, 2008 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I get it, but don't agree

BA has consistently ranked Villalona higher than most regardless of his performance, so they evidently are very impressed with his scouting (or else they are simply trying to stay consistent at this point). They were also down on Montero early when some questions emerged about his age, attitude, and potential failed drug test shortly after he signed. As such, they may still have questions about Montero that may never go away.

http://mvn.com/milb-yankees/

by lemonjello on Sep 24, 2008 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not a bad list....

My only gripes:

1.) Bumgarner over Heyward: Until Bumgarner displays plus breaking pitches, I am inclined to go with the guy that has the highest ceiling of any position player currently in the minors.

2.) I think Michael Taylor should be a bit higher. He showed last year that he can adapt to tougher competition well; I expect him to throttle AA two to three weeks into the season.

3.) Kalish is VERY underrated at this point.

by soccerman0 on Sep 24, 2008 2:32 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

What about Kalish is underrated?

Just looking at the stats (.732 OPS in SAL, .702 OPS in Cal) it would seem that he is overrated, given that he was included among the top 20 prospects in a very strong league. While I imagine he is fast and good defensively, slugging .356 at age 20 in low-A does not seem to merit inclusion on a SAL top 20 list.

http://mvn.com/milb-yankees/

by lemonjello on Sep 24, 2008 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Didnt he have a wrist injury?

That could have sapped some of his power, and I remember hearing about it.

Could be wrong though…

by demondeaconsbaseball on Sep 24, 2008 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think Kalish drop in power is a little overstated....

He did slug .500+ last year in LOW A, and I am inclined to think that that power didn`t just disappear. He knows how to take a walk (he had a very good SO to BB ratio this year) has tremendous speed (19 SB), and as long as his power reappears, he could be a top 5 type player on lists like these. I see him in the 10-15 range at this point. His plus speed and arm combined with a decent bat = huge upside.

by soccerman0 on Sep 24, 2008 2:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

From the chat (slightly edited for relevant parts)

Q: Todd from Chattanooga asks:
Bumgarner had the more impressive year – no doubt, however how close was it between him and Heyward. Isn’t there concern as to MadBum developing secondary pitches that might cause trouble in higher levels? Where do you see these guys spending the year in ’09?

A: Bill Ballew: It was close, but how many true potential number one starters that are lefthanded do you see? Not many. His secondary pitches are coming along. That’s an overrated concern among some people. The kid knows how to pitch and he can flat out overpower hitters. I see a strong possibility of Bamgarner and Heyward splitting the 2009 season between Advanced A and Double-A if they continue at anything close to their current pace.

Neglectful father of David Quinowski

by marcello on Sep 24, 2008 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs

Burgess vs Stanton

Why such different views on Burgess/Stanton?

Similar BB% and K% – but Stanton had an amazing slugging percentage. A lot of that could be due to Stanton’s homepark as Greensboro is an extreme homerun hitting environment when compared to Hagerstown.

I am surprised that Burgess is that far below Stanton – or maybe that Stanton is that high. Certainly Dominguez, Noonan, and Romine cannot be higher than Burgess on people’s overall prospect list.

by gunkdog on Sep 24, 2008 5:04 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Ballew sucks

His top 30s are annual jokes (his and whatever input Callis & co provide). Neftali Feliz #18 while Goldstein has him #3, always way underranking a few Rays prospects, stuff like that. So I wouldn’t expect this to be a great list.

by Brett Perryman on Sep 24, 2008 7:24 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

re: Johnson

I was surprised to see him make the list. Ballew basically said that he’s finally started listening to his hitting coach and not just trying to hit everything over the fence, and that, along with his monster power potential, landed him a spot in the top 20. I’m somewhat skeptical, as his numbers from later in the year (when Ballew said he had started improving his approach) don’t really show a particularly impressive spike anywhere besides power, which is what we already knew he had. If he can get the Ks below 25% for an extended period of time, I’ll listen. But for now, he sounds like a guy with a single amazing tool and not a whole lot else going for him.

by mraver on Sep 24, 2008 9:19 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Response

I watched him play a little over a month ago and came away underwhelmed except for a moon shot he hit off of a mistake pitch. Check it out!

http://baseballhandyman.blogspot.com/2008/08/scouting-sally-cody-johnson-of-atl.html

Mike Newman
baseballhandyman.blogspot.com

by Baseball Handyman on Sep 25, 2008 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Dom Brown

Kinda surprised he missed the list, but this is a VERY stacked league so it’s not all bad.

Also am I the only one who thinks Montero is a little low? I was very impressed when I saw him in person.

by Southwest on Sep 25, 2008 12:42 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I like Brown as a breakout guy for 2010

I think it was John’s comment that his tools are transitioning nicely to skills, and the plate discipline is excellent for a guy who was a raw hitter coming out of HS. I think his 2010 year in AA could be similar to Fowler’s 2008 in AA.

by jibs on Sep 25, 2008 3:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Jesus Montero

Maybe he’s only ranked #7 because he’s a terrible catcher, but he was the most impressive hitter I’ve seen live in a VERY long time including BOTH Freeman and Heyward. He has a line drive stroke that could allow him to win batting titles one day and 25-30 HR potential IMO. I would say more, but his swing is level right now and will need to learn how to add backspin. His ability to stay inside the ball was a thing of beauty though.

He would be #3 on my list.

Mike Newman
baseballhandyman.blogspot.com

by Baseball Handyman on Sep 25, 2008 4:46 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs