T. Teagarden vs. M. Ramirez
by prince of power on Jul 29, 2008 2:38 PM EDT
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PrintWhich prospect would you rather have? Taylor Teagarden or Max Ramirez? Both are catchers in the Rangers system blocked by Salty and Laird. Do you think either will be the Rangers starting catcher in 2008 or do you think they will stick with Salty long term at Catcher now that Chris Davis is entrenched at 1B? Teagarden has power and is a great defensive catcher. Ramirez is a great hitter but is he more likely to switch positions? I don't see why the Rangers don't look to trade one or the other for some young pitching. Who would you keep/trade? Thoughts?
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LoneStarBall
Thers always seems to be some good discussion concerning the Ranger’s catchers over at
"An effortless 98" - Scott Gardner after Neftali Feliz's first AA pitch
Defense vs. Offense
TT is the better defensive catcher while Max is the better offensive catcher. Max might not stay behind the plate and instead could become a DH. TT has more value since good catchers are hard to find and he still profiles to have more offensive power then your average catcher.
Signature! I don't need no stinking signature!!
Could you plattoon?
Maybe platoon the two based on whether you need offense or defense on a given day, like the Blue Jays should have done with David Eckstein and John McDonald?
by David Tokarz on Jul 29, 2008 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Really isn't
You’ve got contact pitchers where you need defense—As a Phillies fan, this would be guys like Jamie Moyer and Kyle Kendrick, and now also Joe Blanton. Strikeout pitchers like Hamels and Myers wouldn’t need the extra defense like that. Granted this is talking more fielders, not catchers.
So as far as catchers go-you look at how wild your SP is, and how well he can manage a game himself, or needs his catcher to walk him through. You also look at the opposing team’s baserunners-can they steal, do they run a lot? For offensively, you look at opposing pitchers (good pitchers you want more offense in the lineup) and the rest of your lineup (if your giving a big bat a night off, offense is slumping).
rather have Teagarden
His defense makes him a surefire starter, and combine that with his Napoli-like power and I like him for a good, productive career.
Caveat: his injuries. Hard to get a read on those.
Ramirez’ defense costs him.
I like Ramirez's bat
better than Davis, he won’t stay at catcher though. Teagarden’s bat was kind of fluky last year.
by number_twentyone on Jul 31, 2008 12:40 AM EDT reply actions
Why was it flukey last year?
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by OldProspects on Jul 31, 2008 12:20 PM EDT up reply actions
+1
he’s been a high average, good eye hitter when healthy….
Insanity is doing the same thing over and over expecting different results.
by biggentleben on Jul 31, 2008 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Yes, but that doesn't mean his 2007 wasn't flukey
His entire career he’s had isolated power in the .170-190 region. Then, with a wooden bat, it shoots up to near .300. Hmm.
This year, it’s down to the .160s, but the point is, it’s back into his traditional range. This isn’t bad – it’s not a knock on Teagarden’s potential to be an asset behind the plate and at it. But the guy just isn’t a Mike Napoli kind of hitter. Teagarden will always have better patience/OBP, and Napoli should (almost) always have a better ISO.
His entire career?
He had 116 ABs in the minor leagues before 2007; I’m too lazy to do the math but in 96 of his ABs, his isolated power was .354. I can only assume that when you say his career, you mean in college – I agree that it’s strange that his power shot up once he entered professional ball and used a wooden bat, but there do exist other explanations other than fluke. When he graduated college he was 21 – it isn’t exactly unheard of for a player’s power to develop after that age (consider Max Ramirez, for example). I’m not saying that he really is the 30 HR bat he resembled in his first minor league seasons, but considering even this year he’s on pace for 20 HRs or so, it doesn’t seem like last year was that flukey
www.loftylantern.com
I would keep both
Does Salty not have the most value? Why not package him with another prospect or two and get that top of the rotation arms Texas craves. Laird, whose under team control for another two years holds the spot and builds on his solid season in the next two years and plays himself into a Type A free agent. Rameriz’s bat and versatility allow the team to carry a third catcher. TT plays 2 games a week to keep Laird fresh and healthy until he takes over the job full-time in 2011.
I think the Rangers are planning on doing just that.
So far no team has acquiesced. Maybe the Red Sox will during the off season instead of resigning Varitek.
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Salty
I don’t know if he still has the most value. He just didn’t do much with a starter audition during Laird’s recovery in July.
But he’s young. You can still say that a little while longer.
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Aug 8, 2008 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions
TT
I’ll take Teagarden over Max Ramirez.
And the Rangers will keep Laird for years to come. Saltamacchia really does suck and Ramirez will be traded.
I’m happy with Laird and Teagarden if that answers your question.
"Over the years, my favorite pastime outside baseball is driving through a pasture looking at cattle." - Nolan Ryan
Both
I would say long term they could both be Rangers with TT getting 120 starts a year at catcher and MaxRam getting the other 42 while playing DH the majority of the time.
This is the Texas Rangers, professional destroyers of hope, we're talking about. - BAC
Sorry
that will not work. Rangers have Laird. And Max Ramirez will not be around to long.
And Teagarden isn’t going anywhere,
"Over the years, my favorite pastime outside baseball is driving through a pasture looking at cattle." - Nolan Ryan
by hurlerhurley on Aug 7, 2008 11:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Laird can be traded
And I never said TT was going anywhere.
This is the Texas Rangers, professional destroyers of hope, we're talking about. - BAC
Honestly....
None of us know how it will pan out. So it should be fun to watch.
What I think will happen though is that Salty either gets traded or becomes the back-up catcher. He did well last season, but isn’t making the needed adjustments this year…. but he is still young. I think Max-Ram becomes the DH next season (Is Bradley’s contract up after this season?) until Smoak is ready to play in the majors. Then I think he takes over 1B and Davis moves to DH. Then, depending on their catching situation (in say 2 or 3 years) one of Teagarden, Laird, Max-Ram, or Salty should be proven to be a full-time starter by then. Also, one will prove themselves to only be a back-up (my guess is Salty). The other two get traded, tried in the OF as starters, or become C/1B/DH/Corner OF bench bats.
"My mom always taught me it's better to laugh at yourself than to laugh at others. She was so wrong. ;)" -Pedrophile
Bradley
Contract up, yeah. One-year, and I could’ve sworn he’d be a deadline trade.
Worst-case JD earned the club an extra 1st-rounder/supp pick. It’s a nice coup.
Rangers watchers predict Washington will politic to re-sign the guy, so there’s that too.
Go Strangers.
by hightowersmith on Aug 8, 2008 12:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Davis will probably
move to the outfield… not DH, I see the Rangers keeping Max unless someone blows them away with an offer… I believe Laird will be traded in the offseason. Salty’ as well in the right deal, but im not counting on it. I think Teagarden is the catcher of the future for the Rangers.
Max Ramirez will not be DH. He will be traded. Seriously The Rangers don’t need Ramirez. They have Laird and TT, Salty might hang around.
Please get over the Smoak love until he proves something
"Over the years, my favorite pastime outside baseball is driving through a pasture looking at cattle." - Nolan Ryan
And you know all this as a fact?
Do you work for the Rangers? If so, I am sure a lot of us would have a lot of other questions. But, if you don’t work for the Rangers or have inside information, you are guessing just like the rest of us.
I do agree though that Smoak has to earn his way to the majors. But I think he has a pretty good shot since he was a college polished hitter. Ya never know though. Freak injuries, transition to wood bats, inability to hit professional quality breaking pitches… lots can happen between now and then. Until this all works out though, all of us are guessing and making up hypothetical situations, even you, as much as you may not want to admit it.
"My mom always taught me it's better to laugh at yourself than to laugh at others. She was so wrong. ;)" -Pedrophile
Just spittin words
Next year’s Texas lineup (After Michael Young is traded to the Giants for a young pitcher/prospect, they resign Milton Bradley and Sign Felipe Lopez):
1: Ian Kinsler, 2B
2. Milton Bradley, OF
3. Josh Hamilton, OF
4. Chris Davis, 3B
5. Max Ramirez, DH
6. Marlon Byrd, OF
7. Taylor Teagarden, C
8. Jarrod Saltalamacchia, 1B
9. Felipe Lopez, SS
Agree with some....
disagree with others.
It was my understanding that Davis was quite the butcher at 3B and that is why they moved him to 1B. I don’t see him moving back if that was the case. I also don’t see Byrd as a starting OF for them next year instead of Murphy, and there is also Mayberry to contend with. I could see them possibly bringing back Bradley next year, and starting him in one corner OF spot and Murphy in the other, with either Byrd or Mayberry backing up both corner OF spots. I do like the idea of Max Ram at DH, and spliting it some with Bradley who has been a littl einjury prone throughout his career.
I also don’t think Salty has the bat for 1B. And I am not sold on Teagarden yet, but that’s a personal thing. Also, I would like to see them alleviate some of their line-up and depth problems by trading for a true lead-off CF. Let Bradley/Murphy/Byrd/Mayberry play LF, move Hamilton to RF, and get a quicker CF. That way you can lead-off the CF, have Kinsler hit 2nd, and then follow that up with Hamilton, Bradley, then Davis. Or go after Raf Furcal in the offseason to replace FLop at SS and lead him off. Those are the two things I would look to do if I were running the team.
"My mom always taught me it's better to laugh at yourself than to laugh at others. She was so wrong. ;)" -Pedrophile
Murphy
Has enough talent to be traded with good return but doesn’t get on base enough. I don’t think his SLG will be taht high for the years to come either. Murphy and Young seem like the two biggest candidates to be traded.
Plus
why spend money on Furcal when you can get a stopgap until Andrus is promoted?
That' exactly why...
with Furcal having a subpar (for him) 2007, and now being injured this season, it’s possible you can get him on a two year deal fairly cheap. Similar to what the Dodgers did with Nomar. Then you have him as a stop-gag and if Andrus develops into a lead-off caliber SS before Furcal’s contract is up, you can trade Furcal and get a little something in return for the stopgag.
"My mom always taught me it's better to laugh at yourself than to laugh at others. She was so wrong. ;)" -Pedrophile
whatever
Young’s contract won’t allow him to be traded.
Davis is not a thirdbaseman.
Salty is not a firstbaseman.
Bradley probably won’t be resigned.
Stick to the Mets.
"An effortless 98" - Scott Gardner after Neftali Feliz's first AA pitch
Arias
If Young was to be traded, I doubt JD would sign much more than a journeyman type SS to a minor-league deal. Joaquin Arias, I imagine, would be given every chance to be the everyday shortstop.
But there is no way that Young will be traded before Andrus is absolutely ready. It’s not a question of tradeability—he’s the Face Of The Franchise, whether Rangers fans like it or not. If he has enough value to be traded, then he has enough value to stay in Texas, and until he starts burning bridges like Teixiera it won’t matter if he’s tradeable or not…that is unless JD pulls an Epstein and trades away the franchise player because the team is a title contender and he’s replaceable.
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