BA 100
For the sake of this thread, let's say its the half-way mark for this minor league season. I'm curious to who is going to be on the Baseball America Top 100 Prospects list, so I thought I would get some ideas from you guys.
Take the team you follow list the players into three catergories: Definites, Probables, Slight Chance. It would also be helpful if you could guess the area he would be in.
I'll take the Yankees:
Definites: Austin Jackson (10-20), Jose Tabata (40-50), Jesus Montero (60 and up?)
Probables: Zach McAllister (80 and up?)
Slight Chance: Mark Melancon (would they have a problem putting a reliever on it?), Gerrit Cole (no idea), Jairo Heredia, Dellin Betances (likely not after poor season)
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Jario
i’d put jario in the “probable” category…....he’s had an excellent season and his ratios look good
I’ll do the Jays (cause I’m lazy):
Definite – Snider (top 10)
Probable – Cecil (75-100)
Slight Chance- Arencibia
by Wheelhouse on
Jul 12, 2008 1:46 PM EDT
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arencibia
he is tearing it up this year at catcher..he is top 50 for sure.
by jsmall404 on
Jul 12, 2008 2:00 PM EDT
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Angels and White Sox...
haven’t been mentioned yet in this thread. Anyone want to give it a go?
by journeymen on
Jul 15, 2008 10:58 AM EDT
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Sox?
One could argue that – by their omission – the White Sox have been sufficiently “mentioned”. :->
by BobbyMac on
Jul 15, 2008 12:59 PM EDT
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White Sox
Lock: Godon Beckham
Possible: Aaron Poreda
Longshot: Clayton Richard
’’We have the horses. Everyone has to stay positive and keep grinding." -Kenny
"Its almost gotten to be obscene that we cant get a man in from third base." -Hawk
by e-gus on
Jul 17, 2008 11:50 PM EDT
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phillies
definite: adrian cardenas, lou marson
probable: carlos carrasco
possible: dominic brown, joe savery, jason donald
ANATOMY OF ERA:
Variables Don't; Constants Aren't
by variablesdont on
Jul 12, 2008 2:01 PM EDT
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Another possible...
Greg Golson. I know he has been injured for awhile and strikes out too much still, but I think his skillset and tools may get him into the last part of the Top 100. I like his power/speed combo. Reminds me of a poor man’s Greg Halman right now. Wrist should be fine by this weekend I read, good enough to play in the Futures Game.
"My mom always taught me it's better to laugh at yourself than to laugh at others. She was so wrong. ;)" -Pedrophile
by Boxkutter on
Jul 12, 2008 2:03 PM EDT
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golson is a personal favorite of mine.
i just don’t see him as a starting outfielder. he’s got great defensive tools, and he’s starting to learn how to hit, but his plate discipline is terrible.
before the season, i supported giving golson a spot on the phillies 25 man roster with the justification being that if he’s ever going to learn how to hit, it’s gonna happen under charlie manuel and milt thompson’s tutelage. and even if that takes 2 or 3 years, golson is still a much more effective 5th OF than so taguchi. golson can actually play CF. golson can actually steal a base. and best of all, golson can actually throw a guy out from LF.
it didn’t happen, though, and i guess that’s okay considering the fact that golson has hit pretty well in AA, but i just don’t think he’s taken a big enough step forward to be considered in the top 100 of baseball.
ANATOMY OF ERA:
Variables Don't; Constants Aren't
by variablesdont on
Jul 12, 2008 2:10 PM EDT
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I can see that
I do think he becomes more than a 4th or 5th OF though. I am probably ranking him too high in my mind (if he hadn’t of been injures I would have drafted him already in our league, and if you trade me that last pick you have, that’s who I would take). He is still young and despite the high K rate has hit 300 so far this year (I see he has just returned from injury) in his first real chance in AA. Spent some time at the end of the season there last year and his numbers this year are much better. I like him as a possible 20HR 30SB OF when he finally settles into the majors with a batting average in the high 270s and about 140K a season.
"My mom always taught me it's better to laugh at yourself than to laugh at others. She was so wrong. ;)" -Pedrophile
by Boxkutter on
Jul 12, 2008 2:17 PM EDT
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I’d rank Carrasco ahead of Marson
ProjectProspect.com - Sullivan10x@yahoo.com
by sully10x on
Jul 12, 2008 2:37 PM EDT
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there is nothing special about carrasco.
marson can flat out hit, he has excellent plate discipline, and he’s been the starting catcher on two straight league championship teams (2006 SAL, 2007 FSL), so i’m pretty sure he knows how to call a game. i don’t really know how well those skills will hold up as he advances to the majors, but right now, his package looks quite good.
as for carrasco, he’s all kinds of solid, but he doesn’t stand out in any way. it’s hard to get much recognition like that, and even though he’s only 21, he’s been on the prospect radar for a long time, and SNTS could take him down to the 70-90 range, which lands him as a solid probable.
ANATOMY OF ERA:
Variables Don't; Constants Aren't
by variablesdont on
Jul 12, 2008 3:06 PM EDT
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Braves
Definites: Heyward, Hanson, Hernandez, Freeman
Probables: Hicks
Slight Chance: Locke, Rohrbaugh
by bravitos5122 on
Jul 12, 2008 2:10 PM EDT
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No Schafer?
"My mom always taught me it's better to laugh at yourself than to laugh at others. She was so wrong. ;)" -Pedrophile
by Boxkutter on
Jul 12, 2008 2:23 PM EDT
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Maybe not
His production has been down drastically since his HGH suspension. Perhaps that severely hurts his prospect standing.
"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."
-Jonathan Swift
by King Billy Royal on
Jul 12, 2008 2:28 PM EDT
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Look Closer
He has been producing runs pretty darned well ( 21 Runs, 24 Rbi in 39 games) and hi OBP is HIGHER than last year in the Sally League. I’d say any difference in percieved production might have more to do with the fact that he is playing AA-BALL, don’t you. He looks like the exact same good propect to me.
by casejud on
Jul 13, 2008 1:51 AM EDT
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Carolina League...
Last year, I should say. he really did tear up the Sally in 2007 but where he is now is a sizable jump for most prospects.
by casejud on
Jul 13, 2008 1:52 AM EDT
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it is kind of interesting that neither of my 2008 draft picks from the braves made this list
i’ll take schafer and flowers over hernandez and freeman most any day.
ANATOMY OF ERA:
Variables Don't; Constants Aren't
by variablesdont on
Jul 12, 2008 4:31 PM EDT
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Hernandez? who do you mean by this? Diory? he’s no-where near 100.
Likewise to Hicks
ProjectProspect.com - Sullivan10x@yahoo.com
by sully10x on
Jul 12, 2008 2:36 PM EDT
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I’d guess Gorkys…
http://mvn.com/mlb-tossingtherosin/
by koolkerns101 on
Jul 12, 2008 3:00 PM EDT
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Definite: Heyward, Hanson, Schafer
Probables: Freeman, G. Hernandez
Slight Chance: Locke, Rohrbaugh, Hicks, Teheran, Flowers, Medlen (starting now, maintaining ratios)
Funny thing is, the Rangers might have as many Braves prospects in the top 100 as the Braves do. :-/
by mraver on
Jul 13, 2008 9:40 PM EDT
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I say Flowers has a good shot as well considering BA was high on him last year and he has been just as good if not better this year (currently 67/66 BB/K ratio) and is hitting well in a pitchers park. Also plays a premium position
Locks: Heyward, Hanson, Freeman, Hernandez
Probable: Schafer, Flowers
Maybe, just maybe: Locke, Teheran (hasn’t pitched in almost a month),
I really think the Braves could have 7 guys in there, which is amazing considering it could have been Max Ramirez and Elvis Andrus in there too. I didn’t think their system was this deep until I stopped and looked recently.
by yondaime4 on
Jul 14, 2008 12:48 AM EDT
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Flowers
I think that they would have to get positive reports on his catching for this to be the case. I do think that six is a distinct possibility for the Braves, which is pretty impressive.
I really think the Braves could have 7 guys in there, which is amazing considering it could have been Max Ramirez and Elvis Andrus in there too.
And Feliz, who was like #12 on their midseason update.
by Brett Perryman on
Jul 14, 2008 12:09 PM EDT
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Mariners
Should be one:
Phillipe Aumont – 40-60 range
Greg Halman – 50-75 range
Wlad Balentien – 75-100 range (huge drop off this year)
Possibles:
Michael Saunders -
That’s all I can think of off the top of my head. I won’t count Clement since he is in the majors.
"My mom always taught me it's better to laugh at yourself than to laugh at others. She was so wrong. ;)" -Pedrophile
by Boxkutter on
Jul 12, 2008 2:11 PM EDT
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Agree to Disagree
Saunders is a definite, and I think a lock for the top 50, unless he implodes.
Aumont is probably in the 70ish range, Halman is so volatile he could be anywhere from top 40 to off the list depending on his 2nd half.
Balentein is off, I bet.
Juan Ramirez and Michael Pineda are long shot possibilities, as is Triunfel.
by gogotabata on
Jul 12, 2008 2:30 PM EDT
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Bow to you...
To be fair, I try to follow all prospects, not just Mariner ones, so my knowledge of them in particular isn’t that great. I am probably underappreciating Saunders, it is very likely he is on the list. I completely forgot about Triunfel, but I think he makes the list if only because of his age, and he is has shown some increase in HR power lately.
Balentien I kept on there just because I know they had him on the list pre-season and I wasn’t sure they would want to drop him completely off yet.
"My mom always taught me it's better to laugh at yourself than to laugh at others. She was so wrong. ;)" -Pedrophile
by Boxkutter on
Jul 12, 2008 2:37 PM EDT
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Balentien...
Wlad just turned 24, and BA tends to have a huge amount of “age bigotry”. I think he has almost zero chance to return to the list. If he’s hitting enough that he’d get BA’s attention, Seattle will play him, IMO, and he won’t qualify.
by BobbyMac on
Jul 12, 2008 5:39 PM EDT
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josh fields
will probably be middle of the pack too.. . hasn’t signed yet, but wont be long til he’s up, probably in a setup role
by SoCalSoxFan on
Jul 13, 2008 7:28 PM EDT
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saunders
saunders got a honorable mention on the top 25 list….....he might even be top 25 by year-end, depending how the olympics go for him
by Wheelhouse on
Jul 12, 2008 2:37 PM EDT
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Rangers
Could have a boat load, and I’m sure I’ll miss a bunch. I’m assuming Chris Davis won’t qualify.
Definites: Neftali Feliz, Engel Beltre, Max Ramirez, Justin Smoak, Elvis Andrus
Possible: Taylor Teagarden, John Mayberry, Julio Borbon, Kasey Kiker, Marcus Lemon, Blake Beavan, Michael Main
Long shot: Jose Vallejo, Omar Poveda, Kennil Gomez, Neil Ramirez
by gogotabata on
Jul 12, 2008 2:36 PM EDT
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Derek Holland
I’d think he’d be more likely to make the list then Lemon, Vallejo, Poveda, and Gomez. I don’t think he’ll make it, but if he keeps pitching as well as he has been, he might get close.
by naropean on
Jul 12, 2008 3:04 PM EDT
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That's pretty optimistic
at least as far as your possibles list goes. None of those guys on the long shot list have a chance, unless someone there really takes a shine to Vallejo. I think Teagarden is a long shot, maybe Borbon and Beavan, but Mayberry, Kiker, Lemon don’t seem like they have any chance, and Main is just getting going after injury so I don’t see how he makes it either.
Time you enjoy wasting was not wasted.
by t ball on
Jul 12, 2008 3:30 PM EDT
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lots of possibilities
I think Beltre is a possible instead of definite. Max Ramirez may get his 120 at bats but I would bet against so he is likely a definite. Eric Hurley is also iffy to qualify for the list, if he is qualified he is at least a possible.
If the Rangers don’t have the highest number of players in the top 100 they will certainly be in the top 3.
by Dalman on
Jul 14, 2008 12:00 AM EDT
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Rangers are Loaded
Graduates: Chris Davis (top 15 if not), Max Ramirez (top 30 if not), Eric Hurley (top 75 if not), German Duran and Brandon Boggs (not top 100)
Locks: Neftali Feliz (top 25), Elvis Andrus (top 50), Justin Smoak (top 50), Engel Beltre (80-90)
Possible: Matt Harrison (could graduate), Taylor Teagarden, Julio Borbon
A year Away: Blake Beavan, Michael Main, Kasey Kiker, Cristian Santana, Neil Ramirez, Marcus Lemon
Wild Card: Martin Perez; 17 year old LHP in NW league with good numbers
If he was Healthy: Wilmer Font; 2nd best pure stuff behind Feliz in Rangers’ system but hasn’t pitched yet in 2008
Worthy but not likely: Derek Holland, Jose Vallejo
"Here comes the version of Benoit that lets the other team put it out of reach. I hate that version."
-Athos
by SaltyDawg on
Jul 15, 2008 3:20 AM EDT
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Yankees...
Jackson will be lower than 10-20, Montero will be higher than you have him, and Tabata will be off altogether or at best 90-100 range. If Tabata does make it, it would be generous and because of his age… he looks awful this year, hasnt done crap, and has added serious attitude questions. He’s off the list. Jackson hasnt impressed, starting really slow and then coming alive a bit… but he’s been underwhelming compared to his hype. All the streakiness does it add more questions about him IMHO. Montero I love, and although he wont catch for much longer he certainly looks like a middle of the order bat. You really have to rake to impress me as a 1B/DH prospect – BUT Montero is doing just that.
I like McAllister, but ARL and relatively unimpressive stuff will almost certainly keep him off the list for BA, who values that stuff more than BP, etc… He’s not a bad prospect, but there will be plenty with better claims to the top 100.
The other dont have a shot other than a real longshot in Melancon and maybe Jairo, but probably not. Its been a bad year for Yankee prospects, who have almost all taken a step back or created major questions. The entire system has really taken a step and a half back.
by alskor on
Jul 12, 2008 2:46 PM EDT
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Disagree with most of this
Jackson was rated #14 by them. He’s just holding his own, but when you compare it to say McCutchen 2007, it looks good. Scouts love his tools and think he’s capable of more.
Tabata will be at least on somewhere. He’ll be back in a few weeks, so his placement will probably depend on what he can show when he returns. He was back to hitting for average after his slow start, but the power remains a question as he recovers from hamate surgery.
McAllister has unimpressive stuff? Low 90s sinker will still room to grow looks pretty good. I don’t think Jairo will make it. Betances might, he has great stuff but is having major issues finding the zone.
A couple of the hitters in Charleston may find their way on late too, as might the guys coming back from injury like Sanchez and Garcia.
by number_twentyone on
Jul 12, 2008 3:33 PM EDT
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typo
replace “will” with “with”
by number_twentyone on
Jul 12, 2008 3:33 PM EDT
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I think Jackson is an overrate at 14 but
he has the tools to be rated highly. That being said, poor Tabata is totally overmatched at AA. He is the yungest OF in the league and it shows. He has the lowest OPS of any qualified OF in the EL. He might make the list on potential/upside but he has been rushed, IMHO. There is a lot to like about Montero but catching isn’t one of them. He is just a bat but could be a very useful one as he moves up. I have to go with alskor or McAllister. Not a bad prospect, just not top 100 IMO.
Overall, the Yankees farm system has taken a tumble. It is hard to believe they spend so much money on the draft and have so little to show. for it.
by sdtribefan on
Jul 13, 2008 2:26 AM EDT
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they've only spent money during the past few years
so you’ve overreacting just a tad.
Tabata hasn’t looked overmatched recently in AA average-wise, so it’s just back to square one with him.
by number_twentyone on
Jul 17, 2008 1:02 PM EDT
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Jackson
Was #41, not #14.
http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/prospects/rankings/top-100-prospects/2008/265658.html
I think Jackson moves up, but is a shade below the 10-20 range that was claimed above. That was the comment I was responding to. I say 20-30. Too many good players with great tools and less questions above him. Still a great prospect. He has held his own, as you said, and should move up… but holding your own doesnt typically launch a toolsy player in the top 20.
Tabata is… terrible. His HR totals from his four pro seasons are 3, 5, 5 and 3. He doesnt walk, and now we have off field problems. I think he gets dropped. If he does make it, he will be plummeting in the rankings. ARL only takes you so far… you still have to produce. Tabata has hung his hat for too long on a high average in the low minors and a good ARL. He is now batting .248/.320/.310. The way he has been handled is troubling as well.
Here’s another thing – shockingly, those high AVG years from Tabata were BABIP driven. He posted BABIPs of .363 and .360. So he had a couple years where he had artifically high batting averages inflated by luck. Other than that he has never hit at all. He has some tools, but there are a number of guys like this and I think most people would take Triunfel, Beltre, Tejeda, Inoa, etc… all over Tabata at this point. Even if we were looking to make a list of just “underperforming, toolsy, international signing, teenage prospects below AAA” Tejada would ranks kind of low on that list now. There are lots more guys with tools almost as good or better than Tabata that play up the middle positions and have done more with the bat. There’s still hope for him and I never write off a guy with tools, but he is now a far cry from an elite prospect. He has done pretty much nothing as a professional baseball player to demonstrate that he should be regarded as an elite prospect. The times he has performed relatively well look like the exceptions rather than the rule now.
McAllister – here’s the rub: look at just the AL East farm systems, and I find pitching prospects I like more and who have more impressive stuff and better resumes than McAllister all over the place. There are at least four guys on the Sox, maybe six on the Rays, and probably four on the Orioles. So, bare minimum that would roughly place McAllister somewhere around the 15th best pitching prospect in his own division. Im ignoring the Jays for now, but there are some arguments there even. McAllister is a nice prospect, and I think he is certainly underrated, but top 100 is a stretch for him at this point. If he had overwhelming stuff and the numbers he has I would say yes. If he had overwhelming numbers with the tools he has I would again put him in. But with those numbers and that stuff I cant see it.
I think of guys like Heath Rollins, who is way down the depth chart of Rays pitching prospects… I dont think McAllister really has any better claim than a guy like him. Theyre nice prospects, but top 100 is beyond them.
by alskor on
Jul 13, 2008 6:20 AM EDT
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A few things
I agree that Tabata has been horrible this season, and has not hit for much power throughout his career. I think you’re misusing the concept of BABIP however. The fact that he has posted consistent BABIP values in the .360’s over the past few seasons would seem to argue that his norm is a high BABIP, and his recent struggles and subsequently lower BABIP are due to bad luck. You have to look at the big sample size to determine a player’s norm when looking at BABIP, and see how it fluctuates. Also, we don’t know how his hamate bone problem, which caused him to miss parts of the last 2 seasons, affected his power. I agree he has definitely hurt his stock this season with his attitude problems and inconsistent performance, but I think he will still be in the top 100.
I think McAllister’s performance is definintely top 100 worthy. He gets a lot of groundball outs with his low-90’s sinker, and has a very low walk rate, and a decent strikeout rate. He compares favorably to Justin Masterson at a similar point in his career IMO, though Zach throws a little harder, and doesn’t rely on the deception of the sidearm delivery. I’d be curious to hear the 14 AL east pitching prospects you would rank ahead of him.
http://mvn.com/milb-yankees/
by lemonjello on
Jul 13, 2008 11:09 AM EDT
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RE: A few things
BABIP – So youre telling me he’s a legit .360 BABIP guy? I think its exceedingly more likely those are outliers. Lets say he is a legit high BABIP player – like .330 range. That would be fairly high. .330 BABIP would still drop 30 points off those averages and nobody knows who this guy is if he never hit HRs and never hit higher than .270s. MLB average BABIP is around .300 in any given year. Let me be clear – Jose Tabata is not going to regularly hit for .60 points of BABIP above league average.
McAllister – top of my head – Masterson, Bowden, Bard, Kris Johnson (is about equal), Price, McGee, Wade Davis, Hellickson, Niemann, Mason, Barnese (roughly equal), Talbot, Rollins, Liz, Arrieta, Spoone, Brandon Erbe (equalish), Dave Hernandez
And PLEASE bear in mind, if you take issue with two or three of these, that does not disprove my larger point. Even if you want to bump him up a couple spots there are lots of better prospects – and this was a non-comprehensive list off the top of my head. Heck, if I put a little more thought into it I might disagree with a couple above – BUT I think Im in the neighborhood here. Many were drafted above where McAllister was and have had better results or have better stuff.
by alskor on
Jul 13, 2008 11:55 AM EDT
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Guh?
Besides the obvious guys (Price, Davis, McGee, Bowden, etc.) I gotta disagree with A LOT of the players you just mentioned, not just a few. Aren’t Bard and Masterson relievers now? Kris Johnson has been awful, and Niemann and Talbot haven’t done much considering their age in AAA. Arrieta is younger and doing worse at the same level. Barnese has had like 4 starts. Erbe is the same age and doing worse at the same level. Hernandez isn’t as good too.
http://yankeesmtom.blogspot.com/
by hallofamer2000 on
Jul 14, 2008 12:26 AM EDT
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McGee - not any more
I know TJ surgery is pretty routine now, but I don’t think he’s going to maintain top-100 status, and almost certainly won’t have it entering the 2010 season after missing most of 2009.
by BobbyMac on
Jul 14, 2008 3:27 AM EDT
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Okay
So, as I predicted above, someone was willing to quibble with some of those choices… but does it disprove my point? My point wasnt that McAllister is around the Xth worst piching prospect in the AL East… it was that he’s not a top 100 prospect. Do you disagree?
by alskor on
Jul 14, 2008 3:12 PM EDT
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Yes it does
Almost everyone you mentioned was wrong. And by saying he’s the Xth pitching prospect in a division, therefore he shouldn’t make it is an awful argument.
Also, say 5-6 pitchers are better in the division. Multiply that by 6 for each division and that gets 30-36. So you’re saying the 31st or 37th best pitching prospect in baseball won’t get in?
http://yankeesmtom.blogspot.com/
by hallofamer2000 on
Jul 14, 2008 7:37 PM EDT
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So you think he's in BA's top 100 then?
I didnt say I agree with you AT ALL with your criticisms of those pitchers, and in fact I dont.
Many of the guys with worse numbers you stated above have better stuff and MUCH better secondary offerings. If I was putting money on guys making it I would still favor guys like Erbe, McGee (even after surgery) and Arrieta. Your problems dont seem to be with “almost all the guys” I mentioned either. Also, Masterson is a starter long term.
My argument that he isnt even near an elite pitching prospect in his division was both valid and a good reason why he wont be a top 100 prospect. I guess we’ll see though. Im fairly confident BA wont have him in the top 100.
by alskor on
Jul 14, 2008 8:00 PM EDT
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This is one of the most convoluted arguments I can recall.
Here is a simple question for McAllister boosters. Is a pitcher who gets hit by LH batters at a .341 average in a league generally considered to be a pitchers league really BA top 100 material? Personally, I do not think so for this and other reasons but he is young enough to improve. He hits a lot of bats for his ceiling to be that high IMHO but if his secondary pitches improve he could get to top 100 some day.
by sdtribefan on
Jul 14, 2008 8:15 PM EDT
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heh, Liz? Talbot?
seriously?
by number_twentyone on
Jul 17, 2008 1:05 PM EDT
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Tabata doesn't walk?
That’s a weird thing to say. Sure you don’t mean F-Mart?
Tabata’s average was fueled by BABIP, but he does have some speed right now, and you can say the same about many other prospects at an early level. Tabata’s cut down on his strikeouts this year, and his BABIP was inching up after a poor start.
by number_twentyone on
Jul 17, 2008 1:04 PM EDT
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Brewers
Near-Locks -
Mat Gamel (15-30)
Alcides Escobar (20-40)
Jeremy Jeffress (50-75)
Probable –
Angel Salome
Maybe’s –
Michael Brantley
Long-Shots –
Jonathon Lucroy
Taylor Green
Jake Odorizzi
Zach Braddock
Brett Lawrie
Personally, while I don’t think the Brewers have more than 4 top 100 guys, there has been so much talk about the talent in their system, especially AA Huntsville (Gammons called it the most talented minor league team he’s ever seen), that a few guys could really sneak up on these lists.
I'll warm up with you anytime
by ufoboy90 on
Jul 12, 2008 2:54 PM EDT
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I agree with most of this list, but I'd bump Lucroy up to a "Maybe"
I think he’s a better prospect than Salome at this point, personally.
He's extremely quick and good.
by battlekow on
Jul 14, 2008 1:11 PM EDT
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Rays
Locks:
Price (if he’s eligible)
Beckham
Davis
Hellickson
Probably:
Brignac
Possibly:
McGee
Sleeper:
Nick Barnese: Dominating Hudson Valley in the mold of McGee/Davis/Hellickson before him. Everything you’d like in a young pitcher. Healthy, some projection, good control (command i can’t answer, it’s early and I’m not a scout), K’ing more than a batter an inning, and an absurd GB rate.
Tools Whore
Sign Bonds!
by Tyler on
Jul 12, 2008 2:57 PM EDT
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how is Briggy not a lock?
i know his stock is down… i can agree with that… but are there 100 players better than him? i don’t think so. not with his D at SS, and his power potential.
by daveh33 on
Jul 12, 2008 5:15 PM EDT
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brignac
geez, tough crowd. He was top 30 last year, and he is still 21 in AA and hasnt been awful by any means at the plate while improving his defense. he is a lock for the top 100…maybe not top 50
by jsmall404 on
Jul 12, 2008 6:29 PM EDT
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i agree, he may slip out of the 50...
...maybe… btw, he is 22 and playing AAA (when not riding pine in tampa) this year…
by daveh33 on
Jul 12, 2008 8:37 PM EDT
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Barnese
just saw him pitch a week ago. Turned out to be one of his “worst” starts (walked 4 in 6 innings, struggled with his control) but he’s a big kid who has plenty of room to grow into his body, and was hitting 91 consistently throughout the game. I didn’t see the guns until the 4th or so, but people around me said they saw him hit 95 early on. He’s also pretty much making mincemeat of NY-Penn, a league of mostly older prospects, as he’s still just 19.
The knock on him is he’s just a fastball pitcher eating up less sophisticated hitters. While his secondary stuff lacked command throughout the start, he did have one just devastating curveball to strike out a batter. The promise is there, and it’ll be interesting to see what kind of attention he gets. I’m going to try and see him again soon.
Definitely someone to keep an eye on.
When asked why I was a Mets fan, I responded, "pain is my lifeblood."
by wrightHOF on
Jul 12, 2008 10:09 PM EDT
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I dunno
I’d put John Jaso, Alex Cobb and Desmond Jennings in the ‘possibly’ range as well, and if so, back end for all three.
I can’t see Brignac dropping out of the top 100 entirely, unless he’s no longer eligible.
I’d say, assuming nothing varies much from the first half in the second half:
Price – top 5
Beckham, Hellickson – top 25
Davis – 30-50
Brignac – 50-70
Cobb – 80-out (doesn’t K a ton, but ERA around 2.5 in the SAL with heavy groundball tendencies)
On the outside : Jaso (but ends up top 50 in BP and Sickels – nearly a 1:2 K:BB ratio), McGee (injury), Jennings (injury), Barnese (BA doesn’t usually put short season pitchers up there unless they were top draft picks or foreign signees, even if their stuff matches up), Lobstein (stock dive hurts)
Vogt early, Vogt often.
by Brickhaus on
Jul 13, 2008 12:15 PM EDT
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Royals
Locks: Moustakas, Hosmer
Probable: Dan Cortes
Darkhorse: Carlos Rosa, Danny Duffy
http://mvn.com/mlb-tossingtherosin/
by koolkerns101 on
Jul 12, 2008 3:03 PM EDT
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Eh...
You see them dropping Cortes from #55 (or whatever) to off the list with the season he’s having? I don’t. Rosa should be assuming he doesn’t exhaust his eligibility and Melville would be a sleeper if he signs.
Rowdy Hardy Fan Club member.
by doublestix on
Jul 12, 2008 3:09 PM EDT
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Well, I’m hesitant to call anyone a “lock” at this point, but I think that is ultimately the case for Hosmer and Mous. Cortes has a VERY good shot at being on there, but I’m also hesitant to predict the backend of the their.
I agree on Melville. Almost listed him and Montgomery as darkhorses, but obviously didn’t.
http://mvn.com/mlb-tossingtherosin/
by koolkerns101 on
Jul 12, 2008 3:26 PM EDT
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Cortes and Wood
will both be the top 100
by jsmall404 on
Jul 12, 2008 6:29 PM EDT
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I forgot about Wood...
Maybe…he does need to step it up though in the second half. His strikeout numbers are really good, so the ERA should come down soon.
Rowdy Hardy Fan Club member.
by doublestix on
Jul 12, 2008 11:14 PM EDT
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Moustakas
I dont think Moustakas is a lock, he looks like a bust to me
"And we'll see you tomoorrow night!" Jack Buck
by Love Twins on
Jul 12, 2008 8:54 PM EDT
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good evaluation
Accidentally not thedude925 anymore. I do hate this new name.
by wildthang on
Jul 12, 2008 9:30 PM EDT
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It was excellent
Rowdy Hardy Fan Club member.
by doublestix on
Jul 12, 2008 11:11 PM EDT
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Tribe
Locks
LaPorta – 5-10 range
Weglartz 25 -35 range
Wes Hodges 60 -75
Probable
Beau Mills 70 -90
David Huff 80+
Darkhorse
Kelvin De La Cruz
Hector Rondon
by ATLTribefan on
Jul 12, 2008 3:27 PM EDT
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Real nice list. I would rate
Weglarz a bit lower, probably 50+. I also think Huff might come in ahead of Hodges and Mills but that’s quibbling. I might get some suggestions about a lobotomy but I would not be altogether shocked to see Adam Miller around the bottom of the list. I also think Rondon is a much better darkhorse than DeLa.
by sdtribefan on
Jul 12, 2008 6:57 PM EDT
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Where you rate Weglarz,
I think you have to rate both Lars Anderson and Logan Morrison. Their numbers are virtually all the same. Granted I don’t know too much about the parks they play in, but they are in the same league and eerily similar players, though Lars gets most of the publicity.
"When Justin Upton faces Lincecum, I think Christ might appear in the heavens, and the world will end." -JakeFree
by JT12340 on
Jul 13, 2008 12:11 PM EDT
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Something about Mills just strikes me as a No. 100 in the making.
by StickRat on
Jul 13, 2008 1:44 AM EDT
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I was thinking 78 but you could be right.
by sdtribefan on
Jul 13, 2008 2:28 AM EDT
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Not that he's Top 100 ...
But what do you guys think of Michael Aubrey at this point?
by StickRat on
Jul 13, 2008 3:42 AM EDT
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Aubrey just has never been healthy enough
to progress. He isn’t the same guy they drafted. The back has taken its toll especially. I think the likelihood of Aubrey going on Cleveland’s 25 man next year is minimal. That means FA and he might be a good pickup. Too many other options at 1B in the Cleveland organization.
by sdtribefan on
Jul 13, 2008 6:33 PM EDT
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Shows how tricky the Top 100 can be
Three years ago, had anyone known Aubrey, Josh Barfield, and Andy Marte were going to be on the same team, it would have been tabbed as a potential infield of the decade.
by StickRat on
Jul 13, 2008 7:29 PM EDT
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Mills
He’s been quietly heating up over the past month or so. His full season slash stats are .276/.360/.502, and that’s after he had a pretty slow start. 15 homers, 26 doubles, and a better walk rate than he had last year. Given his age, I think a lot of people wanted to see him come out and dominate high A ball right out of the gate and he was written off a bit when he didn’t do so. I’d love to see him move up to AA for the rest of the year to see how he fares, but I’m not sure if that will happen.
by jibs on
Jul 13, 2008 10:17 AM EDT
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+1 in a big way!
With 2 or 3 1B options at Akron and 2 still in Buffalo, it it hard to see a promotion for Mills. If there was any chance for Mills or Weglarz to get to Akron, it went by the wayside with LaPorta. Maybe a late season playoff promotion for both.
by sdtribefan on
Jul 13, 2008 6:41 PM EDT
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stuff...
I, too, think Weglarz will be a 50+ guy.
I’m wondering what Chisenhall has to do to make the list. He was one of the best hitters in the draft, but off-field issues caused him to drop… I’d think that if he hits and is a “good citizen” the rest of the summer, he has a chance.
by BobbyMac on
Jul 13, 2008 7:43 AM EDT
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Tigers
Definite:
Rick Porcello
Probable:
none
Darkhorses:
You’re kidding, right? Maybe Larish, or one of the other 2007 draftees?
by demondeaconsbaseball on
Jul 12, 2008 3:55 PM EDT
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re
Porcello is the only Tiger I can see getting on the list.
by SBcaptain2 on
Jul 12, 2008 4:15 PM EDT
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Dodgers
Definite- Kershaw (top 5 if eligible)
After that, I don’t have a good read. All of these players I am going to list have a slight possibility for one reason or another to make the back end:
SS Ivan DeJesus
LHP Scott Elbert
RHP James McDonald
C Carlos Santana
OF Andrew Lambo
by npurcell on
Jul 12, 2008 4:25 PM EDT
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De Jesus
Ivan DeJesus has to make it for me.
by acerimusdux on
Jul 17, 2008 3:13 PM EDT
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Orioles
Definites:
Matt Wieters- Top 5
Chris Tillman
Jake Arrietta
Possible:
Brian Matusz (if he signs)
Brad Bergesen
David Hernandez
by edsachs1 on
Jul 12, 2008 5:14 PM EDT
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i thought so
I thought he would be signed by now. But so far it hasn’t happen. I’ve heard that he may be asking for more then was orginally thought. Hopefully they get it done soon, so he can get some playing time this season.
by edsachs1 on
Jul 13, 2008 2:33 PM EDT
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I'd add Reimold and Snyder to the possible list
Nick Markakis: The Actual Greek God of Walks
by wickedwitch on
Jul 14, 2008 11:48 AM EDT
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Agreed
I think Reimold should defidentally be on the possible list, while I would put Snyder, who has raised his average to .300 in the Carolina League on a dark horse list with Brandon Erbe.
by Birdfan01 on
Jul 15, 2008 12:57 PM EDT
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I think Reimold will lose his eligibility later this season. Hopefully Payton will be traded and he’ll be called up. Erbe is a darkhorse, I kina forgot about him. Snyder has seemed to finally learned to hit. But he’d have to put up incredible numbers the next two monthes in order to make the list IMO.
by edsachs1 on
Jul 15, 2008 4:51 PM EDT
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Reimold
I could see him being called up in September, but I would be surprised if he got enough ABs to lose his eligibility this season. Mostly because the orioles will likely give him a month or two in AAA before premoting him to the Majors. As for Snyder I agree completely he is defidentally a big time long shot
by Birdfan01 on
Jul 16, 2008 12:20 PM EDT
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Cubs
Locks:
Josh Vitters – Probably top 50.
Borderline shot:
Jeff Samardzija – probably 101-150 in my mind, but there is a chance that he goes top 100 with the reports being positive of late.
Jose Ceda – He struggled as a starter … but that shouldn’t hurt his value much as he was projected as a pen arm and has been real good since the move.
Andrew Cashner – I could see Cashner going ahead of Ceda in BA, although he really shouldn’t. Ceda has better stuff, better control as a pen arm, and is ahead of him.
Wellington Castillo – BA does like catchers, and Castillo is one of the best defensively and his bat has been a surprise in AA.
I think at least a 2nd Cubs prospect will make it on. My pick would be Ceda. My guess would be Shark.
by toonsterwu on
Jul 12, 2008 5:56 PM EDT
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Was just writing a Cubs reply...
But you sniped me… :)
I don’t think Vitters is top 50. So much will depend on the next few weeks for him… I am not sure that he’s even a lock for top 100 if he struggles too much.
I don’t think Samardzija will make it.
I do think that Ceda might make it, and could move up on the list if he blows people away.
Nice to read that someone else likes Welington. :)
by BobbyMac on
Jul 12, 2008 6:00 PM EDT
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Sorry to snipe you
On Vitters – All the reports have been positive. His bat is going well. The big issue for many is that he’s at shortseason. That said, if it wasn’t for the injury, he probably would’ve been swinging at Peoria. Even defensive reports have gotten better of late. I think he’s a lock for top 100.
On Samardzija – I wouldn’t disagree with you, as I’m not a big Samardzija fan. But recent reports on Jeff seems to suggest that he’s made some major strides and BA is more upside/toolsy. He’s never going to be a top guy on this board, as his metrics are odd. Heck, he isn’t even a top guy for me. But I can see him squeaking in as a possibility.
by toonsterwu on
Jul 12, 2008 7:26 PM EDT
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Samardzija
I would be extremely surprised if he made his way onto the list. His projectability, athleticism, and velocity certainly warrant him being on the list, but a strike out per nine of 5.06 in 249 minor league innings in no way warrants Samardizija’s inclusion as one of the top 100 prospects in baseball
by Birdfan01 on
Jul 15, 2008 1:06 PM EDT
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Mets
Locks -
Fernando Martinez – Top 30
Possibles-
Daniel Murphy
Nick Evans
Wilmer Flores
Longer Shots-
Mike Carp
Jon Niese
Reese Havens
Eddie Kunz
Still not much going on in the mets system as the top 100 goes, unfortunately.
by thudean on
Jul 12, 2008 6:03 PM EDT
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Niese
I think Niese will be on the list. I’d give Carp and Niese a better shot of showing up than Murphy actually.
by jibs on
Jul 13, 2008 8:24 AM EDT
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Niese
I agree on Niese, I think he’ll show up somewhere in the 50-70 range.
by killa on
Jul 13, 2008 2:09 PM EDT
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Niese - Cont
I had considered niese, however, when BA did an impromptu update of the mets top 10 in a question, Niese wasn’t even the number 2 in the system, which to me meant BA thought he was fringy (while I personally would probably hope he’d be in the bottom quarter of the top 100). That being said, he could easily push himself there if he ends well, but I don’t think at this point I don’t think BA thinks highly enough of him to do it.
As to murphy, with his move to 2nd base (rather than 3rd) and considering the progress with his bat, if 2b is a permanent position change, he’s way more valuable as a prospect with the bat from 2b than from 3b.
Also, whenever a BA guy is asked about carp, they downplay his progress because he technically is repeating the league.
by thudean on
Jul 13, 2008 4:25 PM EDT
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after F-Mart, they're basically all interchangeable, but my $0.02...
Agree with F-Mart (if the Mets don’t call him up)
I’d put Evans and Murphy into the “Longshots” category, and Niese into the “Possibles” category.
I honestly don’t think Havens or Kunz even has a long shot.
by El Duq of Hurl on
Jul 14, 2008 1:36 PM EDT
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My take
Lock:
Fernando Martinez – Top 50
Maybe:
Nick Evans – 80-120
Jon Niese – 80-120
Long shots:
Flores – 80 -150
Parnell – 120-180
Kunz 150-200
Murphy – 150-250
Carp – 150-250
Evans is tough to guess, as I think he is currently under rated by a lot of people. The kid is second in the Eastern League in extra base hits, but hasn’t really even learned to pull the ball yet. I think many under estimate how much upside is still there in that bat. He’s still a bit on the skinny side too. I would have him 80-100. I don’t know that BA will see it my way, but they did at least give him some notice as an HM in their mid-season prospect all-stars.
Niese is sort of where guys like Bowden and Lofgren were a year ago. Really he’s not that far behind Bowden now, but is allowing quite a few more hits. He doesn’t have quite the raw stuff of a Brett Anderson, but the overall package of stuff, age, and polish probably gets him narrowly into the top 100. He is 7th in all AA in strikeouts right now.
Flores is tough to judge just because he’s so far away, and different people will rank those types very differently. BA is sometimes aggressive with high ceiling low level guys like that, so he has a shot.
Parnell’s raw stuff is a good bit better than Niese. But he’s 2 years older and has yet to perform quite as well. The change is supposedly what he needs to work on, but he has actually been better vs. LH than RH batters this season. I think he mainly needs to continue to improve his command.
Kunz has struggled with command as well, with an ugly BB9 of 4.96 for the season so far. But he has improved steadily as the season progressed, and has been lights out in his last 10 appearances. And has only walked 1 batter over his last 8. He can be pretty dominating when he throws strikes, so if the trend continues, he has a shot. And he could get a callup to Shea before long. Right now though, he’s not top 150, and some will ignore relievers anyway.
Murphy’s best fit is probably 3B, where the Mets don’t exactly have a need. I’m intrigued though about them trying him at 2B. He’s a good polished bat, with more defensive versatility than Carp, but probably doesn’t have enough pop to break top 150 unless he shows he can play 2B. I like to compare to Blake DeWitt of the Dodgers.
Carp does have a higher ceiling than Murphy, and is 18 months younger. At times he looks like he can really be something special. But he has been frustratingly inconsistent in his power output. After a red hot April, in which he posted a .998 OPS in 101AB, he has been rather mundane. He still lines plenty of singles with his smoth LH stroke, and gets on base at a very high clip (.370+ every month), but much like last season, the power has again seemingly gone on vacation. In the end, an XBH every 14 PA (his rate for this season) isn’t going to get you into the top tier of prospects at 1B.
by acerimusdux on
Jul 15, 2008 1:06 PM EDT
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Giants
Alderson
Bumgarner
Posey
Noonan
Sosa
All are locks
by jsmall404 on
Jul 12, 2008 6:32 PM EDT
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Slight disagreement
I would have it as:
Definite-
Buster Posey
Angel Villalona
Madison Bumgarner
Tim Alderson
Probable-
Henry Sosa
Chance-
Nate Schierholtz
Nick Noonan
Pablo Sandoval
by RougeGorrila on
Jul 12, 2008 8:19 PM EDT
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forgot about angel and sandoval
sandoval has heated back up in AA…looks like he will make the cut. I still think Noonan and Sosa are in..but you are right, they arent really locks.
by jsmall404 on
Jul 13, 2008 1:26 AM EDT
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hmmm
I wonder if Noonan (good upside, youth, and performance) or Sandoval (hitting as he is) stand a better chance than Sosa to get in, given the age/competition issue.
I might bump Sosa down to ‘chance’ but say that it is likely one of those 4 might make it.
by haverecords on
Jul 14, 2008 7:54 AM EDT
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I’ll admit to some bias here, as I’ve seen Sosa in person and left very impressed. (My notes of that game is here.) I have questions about Sandoval’s ceiling, and I wonder if BA does too. The announcers for the Futures Game were throwing around a Bengie Molina comp which I can definitely see as a possibility.
by RougeGorrila on
Jul 14, 2008 1:41 PM EDT
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Sosa
By the end of this month, he’ll be a 23 year old in High A. His numbers are nice, but I’m not completely sold on him until he shows more at a higher level at that age.
by killa on
Jul 13, 2008 2:11 PM EDT
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Hopefully they’ll be bumping Mad Bum up to High A and consequently bumping Sosa and Alderson up to AA.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
by marcello on
Jul 14, 2008 1:08 PM EDT
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I’d like Alderson to finish the year in San Jose, but I’ll +1 everything else.
by RougeGorrila on
Jul 14, 2008 1:42 PM EDT
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He seems to be handling High A just fine; he might not be dominating it like Bumgarner is dominating A ball, but he’s not really having much difficulty. Why not bump him up a level and give him a bit more of a challenge?
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
by marcello on
Jul 14, 2008 4:19 PM EDT
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Differing philosophies I suppose. As you say he’s not dominating but doing well, and he’s very young for the league. But even if he starts out at AA at 20 next year, he will still be young for the league so I don’t see the rush. It’s not like the Giants are in desperate need of starting pitching. If you keep him in San Jose, he’ll have the chance to further refine his new windup, maybe work on his offspeed pitches against yougner competition whereas if you promote him midseason, there is that small chance that he will struggle and be bounced back to San Jose. That may happen eventually, but I’d like to lower the chances of it.
As a rule, I support midseason promotions if the prospect in question is clearly blowing away his competition or is old relative to his league. For example, I would like to see some of the other members of the pitching staff like Pucetas and English get promoted. But for Timmy II? Eh. I’‘m fine with where he is.
by RougeGorrila on
Jul 14, 2008 5:18 PM EDT
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I’m definitely not up in arms over it (I will be with Mad Bum if they don’t promote him soon), but I prefer a somewhat aggressive approach with prospects. Although, certainly not Mariners style.
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
by marcello on
Jul 14, 2008 5:59 PM EDT
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Minnesota Twins
Definites: Ben Revere, Luke Hughes
Possibles: Danny Valencia, Trevor Plouffe, Aaron Hicks
Long Shots: Jeff Manship, Wilson Ramos, Deolis Guera, Kevin Mulvey – if he puts it together
Where do you think Revere ends up?
"And we'll see you tomoorrow night!" Jack Buck
by Love Twins on
Jul 12, 2008 8:59 PM EDT
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Everyone is a bust there.
Rowdy Hardy Fan Club member.
by doublestix on
Jul 12, 2008 11:12 PM EDT
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Revere
should end up in the Top 50 in my mind.
Hughes is someone, in my opinion, that would be a possibility. BA seems to put a lot players that have high ceilings in the Top 100 (see Guerra) and I am not sure if Hughes has that high of a ceiling. He may be over performing. I could see him maybe at the 75-100 range.
Valencia-I am a big fan of him because he should be our future 3B, and a good one at that. He seems to be adjusting to AA ball lately.
Plouffe-Also another favorite of mine. Still only 22 or 23 and in AAA. Could end up being a decent power hitting SS for the Twins. Needs to cut down on the errors at SS and start to get his BA up.
Guerra-Even though he is not having a good season at all, I think he was in the 30 range in the last Top 100 list. I don’t see him dropping out of the Top100, maybe in the range of 60-75.
All the other “Long Shots” are good choices. I could see Manship in there, possibly. Ramos will be there some day.
Here is a name instead of Hicks, Angel Morales. I am sure many have heard of him. He came from the same academy as Carlso Beltran and is suppose to be the best out of that school since Beltran. He is 18 or 19 and is E-Town Rookie ball. Good power already, but SO too much. Could possibly see Class A Beloit if the Twins decide to call up Revere to Fort Myers for postseason play. Just a thought.
Also, Tyler Robertson will be in the Top 100 for sure.
by ahope on
Jul 13, 2008 9:32 AM EDT
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Marlins
Locks:
Stanton
Dominguez
Maybin
Coglan
Possibles:
Sinkbeil
Morrison
Hernandez
by jsmall404 on
Jul 13, 2008 1:31 AM EDT
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Red Sox
Graduates:
Buchholz (#4, all last season’s ranking)
Ellsbury (#13)
Lowrie (#73, likely will not qualify now that lugo is out)
Locks:
Anderson (#40, not super impressive in context, but certainly done well enough)
Masterson (#64, assuming he qualifies, will be very high)
Bowden (#94, will gain recognition as one of the top pitching prospects in the minors)
Kalish (#96 hasnt taken a big leap forward but is only 20 and looks ridiculous)
Reddick (will be everyone’s favorite arrival on the scene this winter)
Possibles:
Bard (looks nasty, and is for real, but is a reliever and has only done it for one year…)
Improbables:
Tejeda (tools are wicked, but have yet to translate to significant performance)
Kris Johnson (finally living up to pedigree)
CH Lin (toolsy kind of guy BA loves. Questions remain)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Basically, I think the locks are all, well… locks. Kalish aint dropping off and the guys above him are all written in stone. Reddick is absolutely in. Count on it. I dont really think Bard will crack the list, but he has been filthy. He could show up in the 90-100 range and I wouldnt be shocked. I wouldnt put him on my list, but he seems like the kind of guy BA goes for. The other guys dont have a chance, but could crack the list in the future… theyre on the radar.
by alskor on
Jul 13, 2008 5:39 AM EDT
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Reddick
Sort of surprised no one has responded to his inclusion. Is everyone on board the bandwagon already? You should be.
I have no doubt Kalish is in, and if so… well, Reddick is now the better prospect in many ways. He has to be on the list.
by alskor on
Jul 16, 2008 5:28 PM EDT
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Locks
Cahill
Anderson
G.Gonzalez
Probable
Simmons
Doolittle
Carter
Inoa
Possible
Mazzaro
Brown
Rodriguez
by DeJay on
Jul 13, 2008 7:38 AM EDT
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Stone cold lock
He’s Top-50 and possibly Top-25
Tools Whore
Sign Bonds!
by Tyler on
Jul 13, 2008 10:49 PM EDT
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Not that I'm disagreeing-- I know what BA's lists are like
but I find that a deeply weird philosophy. There’s probably a 50-67 percent chance that he never makes a major league roster in his life. And I say that as someone who 100% backs the decision to sign him for the money they paid.
I wonder if Arnold Leon could sneak onto their list somewhere. I won’t bother to hope Aaron Cunningham will, even though he should.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
by PaulThomas on
Jul 13, 2008 10:56 PM EDT
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If you find it deeply weird
you’re probably putting too much emphasis on who might just make a big league roster and not enough emphasis on who might make a meaningful difference for the franchise. If Inoa does pan out, he’s up there with or past Cahill in terms of impact. And I also think that you’d be too prone to thinking that all “top” latin signees are created equally. Some people obviously think that this guy is a singular talent that stands beyond even guys like Fernando Martinez and Angel Villalona, guys who almost certainly will be major leaguers at the least.
by Brett Perryman on
Jul 14, 2008 12:14 PM EDT
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Well, if you take that approach
it’s no wonder that you’ll come out with a top 100 list that’s filled with high upside lottery tickets with low probabilities of actually making an impact.
I don’t want to say that value over replacement level is the only metric that matters, because it’s harder to find guys at the elite end of the bell curve, but it’s certainly by far the most important metric—and Inoa’s average VORP is heavily weighed down by the risk that he never reaches the majors at all (and if you think he’s “almost certain” to reach the majors, all I can say is that you’re wildly optimistic about the risks of injury and ineffectiveness to young pitchers).
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
by PaulThomas on
Jul 14, 2008 12:38 PM EDT
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Leon
I am really looking forward to seeing what Leon can do over a full season, hopefully as a SP, next year. I don’t think there is much chance that he makes the list this year (limited IP in relief), but he is certainly one who is capable of shooting up future lists.
by DeJay on
Jul 15, 2008 6:45 AM EDT
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I think Leon will make it next year after he becomes a SP
For those who don’t know, Leon was limited to RP duties in Stockton (A+) and in the Mexican League due to an agreement between the A’s and his Mexican League team. The A’s signed Leon/Purchased his contract from his team, but part of the agreement was that the A’s would use him as an RP to limit his innings, and would lend him back to the Mex team during the 2nd half of their season to finish his contract with them. The Mex team as well will use (and had used him in the past) as an RP. The reason he was used as an RP by the Mex team in the first places was not because he wasn’t good enough to be a starter, but the team wanted to protect his arm because he was so young.
facepalm.jpg
by Zonis on
Jul 17, 2008 2:20 AM EDT
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Response
I imagine there will be quite some variation there in opinions on his actual placement. Some may have in the 60s-70s, but I’d at least mildly surprised if one or two of the BA committee don’t slot him into the top 25-30 prospects.
by mrkupe on
Jul 15, 2008 1:22 PM EDT
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Inoa
I agree with you – he is pretty much a lock to get on BA’s top 100 list. Callis recently said he would rank in the bottom third of the list behind Cahill, Anderson and Gonzalez. I was just a bit hesitant to put a 16 yr old who has yet to throw a professional pick in as a lock, although I suspect he will be.
by DeJay on
Jul 15, 2008 6:42 AM EDT
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Callis
Callis also sometimes starts low on new guys, actually. I remember tracking his response to a “where does Lincecum fall?” question regularly asked in his chats after the season ended in 2006. He started out in the middle but after 50, and he steadily moved up, presumably as Callis got up to speed on just how impressive he looked in his short time in the pros (even though he was extremely high on him as an amateur). Without throwing a pitch he slowly moved to elite status in Callis’ estimation. Anyway, I wouldn’t be shocked to see that from Inoa, as the scouting hype engine (especially since it was a team like the A’s that signed him) rolls through the winter.
by Brett Perryman on
Jul 15, 2008 7:03 PM EDT
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'Burg's best it's been in a long time
Pittsburgh:
Pedro Alvarez
Andrew McCutcheon
Steven Pearce
Neil Walker
101-150 ? Tanner Scheppers
by ByANose on
Jul 13, 2008 9:42 AM EDT
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agreed
Much better than usual, but if Neil Walker hasn’t sucked his way out of the top 100, no one ever will.
I’d suggest Jamie Romak as a distant sleeper . . .
by gogotabata on
Jul 13, 2008 10:37 AM EDT
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Nats
I’m not even a Nats fan but I’ll give them a crack.
Definite:
Chris Marrero
Aaron Crow (once he signs)
Possibles:
Jordan Zimmerman (if there’s justice, he’ll be in the 70 – 100 range)
Michael Burgess
Long Shot:
Ross Detwiler (if only due to name recognition, he’s had the occasional strong showing, but the lack of control is disappointing from a college draftee)
Actually given the tools and power numbers, maybe Burgess is a lock to be on the list.
by jibs on
Jul 13, 2008 10:36 AM EDT
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burgess and zimmerman
are in. Probably in the 60-90 range. Burgess made alot of lists with barley playing last year, and Zimmerman has been outstanding..he could probably be top 50 really
by jsmall404 on
Jul 13, 2008 4:38 PM EDT
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What do you think of comparing Burgess to Chris Davis?
Obviously he has a ways to go, but he seems to have a reasonable chance of developing in that direction
www.loftylantern.com
by OldProspects on
Jul 13, 2008 6:58 PM EDT
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Cardinals
Locks:
Colby Rasmus(OF logjam keeps him from graduating)
Brett Wallace
Jaime Garcia
Probably:
Bryan Anderson
Jess Todd
Maybe:
Daryl Jones
Allen Craig
Clayton Mortensen
Jon Jay
Pete Kozma
by mateodh on
Jul 13, 2008 11:07 PM EDT
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Anderson and Jones
I’d move Bryan Anderson up to a lock. He is up there with Wieters as the best catcher in terms of hitting for average. He still hasn’t hit for much power though its likely the 21 year old is just trying to get hits in leagues that are filled with 23-26 year olds. I still think 10-15 HR power isn’t out of the question. Defensively he has improved but is still weak compared to other top 100 catchers. Won’t keep him out of the 75-100 range, though.
Daryl Jones is a BA favorite. They love his tools and potential and now they can love his production. His turnaround this year has been amazing however it is something BA has been calling for since he was drafted. They’ve always said he is going to take time to develop but could be a really special player when he does. Jones is one of the best athletes in all of the minors with a chance to be a 30-40 SB guy. And the power he has displayed in the FSL is somewhat remarkable for the type of player he is. I wouldn’t say he is a lock, but definitely a probable top 100 prospect.
by UncleBuck44 on
Jul 15, 2008 2:04 PM EDT
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Reds
I’ll give it a shot. Surprisingly, as three top prospects are making contributions to the major league team this year, and Bailey not qualifying (with 63 MLB IP) anymore, there still seems to be a bit of quality.
I think they have 4 top 50 players (likely impact players):
Chris Vailaika is a 22 year old SS who played in the futures game.
Neftali Soto, only 19 years old, has an OPS over 1.000 between Billings and Dayton. He may be ranked very highly (10?)
Sean Henry is a 22 year old in AA with an OPS of .892.
Daryl Thompson is also 22, and has a 23/84 bb/k ratio and .218 BAA between AA and AAA.
I think there are 2 guys who are 50-100 (likely role players):
Brandon Waring is 22 and has a .850 OPS in Dayton.
Todd Frasier is another 22 year old, with a .875 OPS between Dayton and Sarasota.
I don’t think Drew Stubbs qualifies any more. He’s only 23, but he was just promoted to AA after an uninspiring .751 OPS in high A.
Often wrong, never uncertain.
by sidnancy on
Jul 14, 2008 4:13 PM EDT
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I think you’re placing too heavy a weight on the actual statistics. Soto MAY be a top 100 guy. He isn’t going to be anywhere near the top 10.
Jim Callis has said that he considers Frazier to be the No. 1 Reds prospect, with Yonder Alonso taking over at No. 1 after he signs. I’d be very surprised if Stubbs didn’t make the list. He’s got tools galore, pedigree, and improving the walkrate while cutting down on the strikeouts. The guy’s floor is 4th-5th OF at the major league level due to his plus-plus speed and glove in CF – if he can hit at all he’s a regular, and if he hits pretty well then he’s an above-average player.
Thompson and Valaika should make solid showings. Kyle Lotzkar and Devin Mesoraco are potential placers off the top of my head as well.
by mrkupe on
Jul 15, 2008 1:20 PM EDT
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Well, Stubbs had those same tools last year
and was the #100 person on the list. This year he seems to have mildly improved (he’s striking out a little bit less, walking a bit more) but certainly not to a degree that he would be definitely in the top 100. He’ll probably be on the bubble between making the list and not making the list again
www.loftylantern.com
by OldProspects on
Jul 15, 2008 3:08 PM EDT
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Response
The list is just going to be way weaker this year than it was last year (or in just about any year in recent memory IMO). If Stubbs was performing along the exact same lines that he did last year at a slightly higher level of play, then I’d say that he might stay exactly where he was at or perhaps move up a bit. As it is, he’s actually improving as he faces better competition.
I wouldn’t expect a top 50 placing out of him unless he just goes nuts in AA and shows that he can be a true five tool guy against serious competition, but top 75-80 doesn’t seem like a huge stretch here.
by mrkupe on
Jul 15, 2008 10:44 PM EDT
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Cool
As I said, it was just a shot – it was 2 full days, and no one had mentioned the Reds (and another day before anyone commented). A couple of thoughts, though:
1. Soto should be solidly on the list, as he’s a 19 year old SS hitting the cover off the ball. Top-ten might be high, but off the list would be shocking to me.
2. Stubbs probably won’t see the bigs before he’s 25. That doesn’t sound like “top 100 prospect” to me.
But you’re right, all I have to go on is the stats.
Often wrong, never uncertain.
by sidnancy on
Jul 16, 2008 9:23 AM EDT
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The important question isn’t how old Stubbs will be when he reaches the majors. The question is what kind of player will he be when he gets there. If he can just manage to sustain his present level of production as he moves up, the other stuff he brings to the table will make him a very valuable player.
He was a top 10 draft pick who came with the caveat that it might take him some time to develop skills to go along with his great tools. He seems to be holding his own at the very least.
by mrkupe on
Jul 16, 2008 12:25 PM EDT
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Soto moved to 3B
Rowdy Hardy Fan Club member.
by doublestix on
Jul 16, 2008 1:39 PM EDT
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Agree with Mr Kupe
I actually have seen some of these guys play in the FSL..
Todd Frazier is maybe the best athlete I’ve seen this year aside from Desmond Jennings.
Sean Henry is more of a 4th OF. He’s on the short side (shorter than his listed 5’ 10”) and isn’t really going to develop more power than he has now. So he really doesn’t have a high ceiling, though he has a very polished line drive strike now with a quick bat. You can make a case for him in the 150-200 range. I do think the Mets undervalued him, but they wouldn’t have traded him for Jeff Conine a year ago if he were that close to being a top 50 talent. He’s performing pretty much as I would have expected.
Of course it is hard to do these rankings. None of us have that much to go on besides stats. My own expertise beyond that is limited to guys who cane through one league and mostly Mets guys, because that’s the farm team I follow.
by acerimusdux on
Jul 15, 2008 1:44 PM EDT
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LOL
Well done.
Rowdy Hardy Fan Club member.
by doublestix on
Jul 15, 2008 4:11 PM EDT
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Angels
Top of head (and I don’t know the system that well):
Locks:
Brandon Wood (35-60)
Jordan Walden (50-80)
Nick Adenhart (70ish?)
Near-Lock:
Peter Bourjos (80-100)
Possible:
Hank Conger
by gogotabata on
Jul 15, 2008 1:36 PM EDT
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Brandon Wood that high? Really?
He looks bustier than Pamela Anderson at this point.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
by PaulThomas on
Jul 15, 2008 2:20 PM EDT
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It works on multiple levels!
Neglectful father of David Quinowski
by marcello on
Jul 15, 2008 4:22 PM EDT
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Does Wood even still qualify?
facepalm.jpg
by Zonis on
Jul 17, 2008 2:13 AM EDT
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Athletics
Locks:
Cahill
Anderson
Gio Gonzalez
Michel Inoa
Possibles:
Sean Doolittle
James Simmons
Chris Carter
Henry Rodriguez
Vince Mazarro
Long shots
Aaron Cunningham
Matt Sulentic
Jemile Weeks
by blee1134 on
Jul 15, 2008 1:51 PM EDT
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Weeks and Cunningham
Have to be in I would think… toolsy BA favs.
Mazarro I would drop to the long shots. Lots of reasons to like him, but BA wont look past the 6.39 K/9. I would say everyone on your lists is in except for Mazzaro and Sulentic – with Sulentic having a real good chance. BA is going to love the A’s.
by alskor on
Jul 15, 2008 2:25 PM EDT
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BA didn't grade Weeks very highly in their draft preview
Unless he absolutely torches things in his first half-season, I can’t possibly see them ranking him top 100 overall.
Cunningham is the opposite of toolsy. He’s a performance guy who scouts hate—very similar to another Aaron (Rowand) in that people can’t figure out why he’s as good as he is. A “long shot” at best. I think Corey Brown has a better chance of making their top 100 (granted it would probably require him hitting double digit home runs in his last 50 games at Stockton) than Cunningham does.
Sulentic is like Cunningham but with worse defense. I wouldn’t even call him a “long shot.”
If I had to wager a guess I figure they find some excuse to not pick Simmons and the A’s have seven on the list (the rest of the “locks” and “possibles” except Mazzaro).
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
by PaulThomas on
Jul 15, 2008 7:46 PM EDT
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You think Henry Rodriguez will make it?
I think Simmons has got to be considered better than him
www.loftylantern.com
by OldProspects on
Jul 15, 2008 7:54 PM EDT
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Again, I'm trying to project BA's rankings
Simmons was not in the Futures Game, Rodriguez was.
I think Simmons is a vastly superior prospect, but I’m not them.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
by PaulThomas on
Jul 16, 2008 2:35 AM EDT
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Cunningham not toolsy?
I was under the impression he was quite an athlete. Very fast… no?
by alskor on
Jul 16, 2008 5:50 AM EDT
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Don't think so
I mean, he’s not SLOW… he’ll probably steal as many bases as Bobby Crosby or Mark Ellis… but he’s not really the kind of guy who can run at will, the pitcher has to be doing something that lets him get a big jump.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
by PaulThomas on
Jul 16, 2008 10:49 AM EDT
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19 and 22 SBs
19 in 95 games in 2006
22 in 67 games in 2007
For an A’s prospect that is pretty good.
Looking back at BP’s review of him in 2007 (subscription) they said this:
Above-average runner.
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=5804
Also saw this:
Currently splitting time between all three outfield positions, Cunningham’s tools great[sic] out at least average across the board, and while it’s hard to figure out exactly where he fits within Arizona’s crowded outfield situation, that’s no reason to downgrade him as a prospect.
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=6610
He’s interesting in the sense that while he lacks that one plus-plus ability to wow scouts, all of his tools rate at least as average.
http://www.baseballprospectus.com/article.php?articleid=6681
So I guess you’re right. Toolsy wasnt the right word… I just always thought of him as being a guy who is pretty good at everything and had good speed. Mind’s eye kind of thing…
by alskor on
Jul 16, 2008 5:25 PM EDT
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He's a lot like Chris Denorfia
but younger, (hopefully) healthier, and with more upside. The A’s seem to like that kind of player.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
by PaulThomas on
Jul 16, 2008 5:57 PM EDT
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re: Vinnie Mazarro
I don’t know. Porcello has a 5:9 and he’s in their top 10 right now. Not comparing Mazzaro to him, just saying.
Mazzaro leads the Texas League in ERA at the moment by 0.76 runs at 21 years old. And it’s not as if he doesn’t have very good stuff.
by blee1134 on
Jul 15, 2008 2:53 PM EDT
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I've never heard anyone describe Mazzaro as having good stuff
He has a good sinking fastball, but that’s about it as far as I know.
He must be doing something right in Midland, but that doesn’t mean that BA is going to give him any credit for it.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
by PaulThomas on
Jul 15, 2008 7:49 PM EDT
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re: Maz
He has a live arm, with a fastball at 88-92 mph that touches 93. He gets exceptional movement on the pitch because he throws across his body from a high three-quarters angle.
“He’s got very good stuff,” Lieppman said. But that is not all that has impressed the A’s. “I really like his makeup. That he could come in as a young player, not having been in the program, and show up at instructional league and have the presence that he had on the mound is really something.”
Chris Kline: Well, the stuff is all power and he’s needs something softer to give him another option. If his changeup comes along, Mazzaro could move quickly.
Mazzaro tossed 8 shutout innings tonight with 4 hits, 0 walks and 10 K’s. As a 21 year old in the Texas League, his ERA now sits at 2.11. His GO:FO is 1.66 with 3 HR’s allowed in 119 innings. In his last 90.1 innings, he’s K’ed 78, hasn’t allowed a HR and sports a 1.90 ERA.
He HAS to be a top 100 guy, right?
by blee1134 on
Jul 16, 2008 2:14 AM EDT
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Inoa
Does anyone have a clue where this kid is going to fall in the top 100? Is he ahead of Beckham and Alvarez?
by thefordhamflash on
Jul 15, 2008 3:45 PM EDT
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how many locks
I would be interested if anyone could total up how many “locks” there are. My guess is that number may equal a bit more than 100
by VanillaGorilla on
Jul 15, 2008 6:19 PM EDT
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Is it like March Madness?
(Actually, the reputable prognosticators, like Andy Glockner, have started really cracking down on the term “lock” lately. But it used to be that you’d see like 40 locks in mid-February, which was ridiculous.)
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
by PaulThomas on
Jul 15, 2008 7:30 PM EDT
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Total locks
76 so far, so no, not over 100, and there are about five ‘locks’ that are questionable.
Vogt early, Vogt often.
by Brickhaus on
Jul 16, 2008 10:20 AM EDT
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All men are created equal. Some were born to be Giants.
From the Giants I would assume Madison Bumgarner, Tim Alderson, Buster Posey and perhaps Angel Villalona would make a top 100 list, with Henry Sosa and Pablo Sandoval being dark horses.
by sharksrog on
Jul 15, 2008 6:49 PM EDT
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Rockies....
I’ll give it a shot
Definite:
Dexter Fowler
Ian Stewart (if he still qualifies)
Jhoulys Chacin
Probable:
Casey Weathers
Possible:
Hector Gomez
Franklin Morales
Greg Reynolds
Did I miss anybody?
by DenverBears on
Jul 16, 2008 10:18 AM EDT
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Reynolds
has 57.2 IP with the Rockies. That would DQ him, wouldn’t it?
"Dying is no big deal. The least of us will manage that. Living is the trick." - Red Smith
by finman on
Jul 16, 2008 1:34 PM EDT
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you are correct....
my bad.
Also, Morales has exceded the rookie limit and doesn’t qualify.
I also expect Stewart will not qualify by the end of the year.
by DenverBears on
Jul 16, 2008 3:54 PM EDT
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The Metsies
Definite: Jesus Fernando Martinez (Top 15)
Probable: Jon Niese (Somewhere in the Bottom 25, but I’m an optimist)
Slight Chance: Reese Havens (Bottom 10: Good for a Middle Infielder, which could get some attention)
by METSMETSMETS on
Jul 18, 2008 8:52 PM EDT
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The A's
Definite: Christopher Carter (Top 30. ANIMAL), GioGo (Top 20 because of projectability, needs control), Fautino DLS (40-50), Hank Al Rod (40-50), Branderson (30-40), Trevor Cahill (20-30), Michel “Gigantor” Inoa (30-40), Adrian Cardenas (40-50)
Lazy
by METSMETSMETS on
Jul 18, 2008 9:00 PM EDT
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I dunno....
De Los Santos won’t make it because of the Tommy John surgery. Henr Rodriguez might make it but not a definite.
But Sean Doolittle will probably make it.
facepalm.jpg
by Zonis on
Jul 18, 2008 11:34 PM EDT
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Ridiculously
Brackman made it last year, and FDLS has twice the pedigree that loser does.
by alskor on
Jul 20, 2008 1:57 AM EDT
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