Josh Fields-RHP
by prince of power on Dec 12, 2008 4:03 PM EST
29 comments
RHP Josh Fields was a college senior at Georgia last year and was drafted in the first round (#20 overall) by the Seattle Mariners. He was a college closer and drafted by the Mariners previous regime. Many Seattle Fans questioned the pick for a non-contending team. He has yet to sign and has until next June to sign. If he doesn't sign, he can go back in the 2009 draft and Seattle will receive a 2009 1st round compensation pick. (#21 I believe).
What are your thoughts on this situation? Will or SHOULD Seattle even attempt to sign him?
New GM Jack Z was a draft guru for the Brewers and many think he'd prefer to have the pick in 2009.
However, now that the Mariners have traded closer J.J. Putz, they look to be in need of bullpen help. If signed. Fields would be on a fast track to the majors.
If you are the Mariners, do you sign him or not?
If not, who do you think will be the future closer for the Mariners?
1) Brandon Morrow
2) Free Agent
3) Other in-house option
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Fields
If he doesn’t sign, he would become a free agent, not go back into the draft pool, because he’d be treated like a 5th-year senior.
Vogt early, Vogt often.
by Brickhaus on Dec 12, 2008 4:11 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
No, he would go back into the draft pool
Otherwise, why on earth would he ever sign? He’d just wait a year and become a free agent, where he could actually get paid fair market value instead of whatever the team feels like giving him.
Obvious loopholes like that have a way of getting closed pretty damn quick.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
by PaulThomas on Dec 12, 2008 4:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That's his leverage
Players 5 years after starting college become free agents. Unless they changed the rule in the last year, that’s how it works. Every year, a good number of redshirt seniors sign before the draft even happens because of this rule.
Vogt early, Vogt often.
by Brickhaus on Dec 12, 2008 5:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
With the caveat
I’ll grant that there’s a reasonable possibility this rule was changed the last time they redid the CBA and when they changed the rest of the draft rules (i.e. eliminating D+Fs, etc.). Usually the Rays sign a few of these 5th year seniors, and I don’t remember them doing that this year.
Vogt early, Vogt often.
by Brickhaus on Dec 12, 2008 5:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
wrong
He goes back into the draft, otherwise every senior would do that and just cash in.
Touch em all Joe...
by FisherCat on Dec 12, 2008 5:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
So few seniors can sit out a year and get enough more to make it worth it
How many seniors are thought to be top picks each year? Maybe 5? And they usually still have an incentive to sign for slot because a player’s value historically reduces if they sit out for a year (with a few high profile exceptions). Other high round seniors are usually picked there because they can be lowballed. Unless you’re going to get a $1M+ signing bonus, it makes no sense to sit out for a year if you want to make baseball a career. By the time you sign, you’re already 22 or 23 going into low-A, and you’ve had to take out a ton of debt just to sustain yourself while waiting. It’s a no-win situation for the player except in very rare situations like this one. It’s also a reason the Brewers gave LaPorta slot last yea.
Please explain how this is different from a 5th-year senior who signs before the draft. The best of those guys usually get signed for $75k, max.
Vogt early, Vogt often.
by Brickhaus on Dec 12, 2008 5:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
5th year seniors
Are those guys typically drafted the year previous?
by aCone419 on Dec 12, 2008 5:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Under the old rules
They wouldn’t have been able to, because the teams would still have the right to sign them until a week before the next draft. I guess that’s the answer then, since the new rules didn’t change the treatment of seniors in that regard.
Vogt early, Vogt often.
by Brickhaus on Dec 12, 2008 6:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
My take...
Will they? Probably. Boras will stretch it out until the last week Fields is eligible to sign, and the Ms will make a token increase over slot money to make Fields feel a little better about the holdout – maybe $50,000 or so.
Should they? Probably not. Zduriencik’s claim to fame is building teams through the draft. Give him 5 top-50 picks to work with and see what happens.
by slamcactus on Dec 12, 2008 4:29 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Miguel Bautista seems like the logical choice to start ‘09. A closer only needs to be as good as his team, and it seems the Mariners aren’t soon pushing to be a legit contender. Might as well throw him into the fire since he’s making close to eight figures a year.
Also, I liked the way Mark Lowe finished the season. It was his first full big-league season after returning from an arm injury, so the +5.00 ERA could be misleading.
So far as 2010 and beyond … yes, the Mariners should certainly make a push to sign Josh Fields and look to him as the closer of the future. Trading J.J. Putz doesn’t signal that that is going to happen. However, that the M’s were willing to take a chance on Fields in the first round means they should make every effort to sign him.
by StickRat on Dec 12, 2008 5:20 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
The Mariners...
would do well to stick a flyballing reliever who can miss bats in the closer role and have their now-excellent defensive outfield and Safeco make him look better than he is, and then try and flip him at the deadline. Heilman is an excellent candidate if the Ms can convince him to abandon his slider. Mark Lowe can probably stick as well if he trusts his stuff more next year.
Good defense and a little luck can make a lot of guys look like solid closers when they’re not really relief aces. There are still about 12-15 teams who will pay too much for that label.
by slamcactus on Dec 12, 2008 5:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
heilman
isn’t he a fastball, slider, and splitter guy? I thought his out pitch was a splitter? He’s a fly ball pitcher? I’m not being sarcastic, I am just basing this off the most recent scouting report I could find from years ago.
by IHateMitchMustain on Dec 12, 2008 6:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Heilman...
His fastball/change are his most effective pitches. In the last 3 years, he’s had a G/F just below average in 2 of them and just above in ‘07. He’s not an extreme flyballer, but he’s nothing close to a groundball specialist, so he’s the kind of pitcher who can benefit a lot from a good defensive outfield and deep fences.
by slamcactus on Dec 12, 2008 9:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I suspect the change and "splitter" are the same pitch
He may have changed the grip on it but the aerodynamics/motion/speed of splits and changes are basically the same.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
by PaulThomas on Dec 12, 2008 11:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i looked on mlb
he has a career go/fo of 1.38 i think, and last season was the extreme outlier, so clearly he isn’t a “flyball” pitcher
by IHateMitchMustain on Dec 13, 2008 12:27 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
'08
and ‘06 were virtually identical as far as g/f went. He pretty clearly doesn’t have the same ability to induce grounders that he had in ‘03-’05.
by slamcactus on Dec 13, 2008 12:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm voting for Carlos Silva as closer. He could pump his fastball up there at 87 in a one inning role
and never walk anybody. Also they’d bring in the defensive replacements in the 9th inning so he’d benefit a lot.
It's not the results, it's how you look going about those results -- Tim McCarver
by WaddellCanseco on Dec 12, 2008 9:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Heilman
Didn’t he demand a trade from the Mets because he wanted to be a starting pitcher?
by StickRat on Dec 13, 2008 3:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think
he demanded a trade, a lot of teams just thought he had potential as a starter.
I am like your Dan Aykroyd and biglow would be Jane, the ignorant slut. -Chad
by thecoolest on Dec 13, 2008 6:42 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
al reyes?
is he still a free agent? would seem like a good gamble if he can put up some numbers like he did with the rays in 07.
I am like your Dan Aykroyd and biglow would be Jane, the ignorant slut. -Chad
by thecoolest on Dec 12, 2008 7:26 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
If I'm Z, I'll try to sign Takashi Saito
using leverage with the Japanese base. If not, I’ll try to convince the ownership why we should. If he busts, he busts, but if he doesn’t, they have a hot commodity at the trade deadline to further build the future club.
I wouldn’t sign Fields at this point. Just use the pick for next year.
by Daniel Berlyn on Dec 13, 2008 5:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think I'd let him go
Clean start, and I’m not toally sold on him anyway. Only downside is that you can’t do it over and over, so they have to be a little careful with the pick as far as signability.
by Brett Perryman on Dec 12, 2008 9:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
True, but even a "signability pick" at #21 is sandwich-round talent
which is probably worth more to the team than Fields is.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
by PaulThomas on Dec 12, 2008 11:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Josh Fields
For me he has some value to the Mariners because the Mariners will not compete this year but anyway IMO Josh Fields needs at least a year or more in the minors before being ready for the Big Leagues and yes, I think the Mariners have some talent in the Minors.
Also, scouting reports on Josh Fields all over the Internet said he is a talented pitcher and why not go the Blue jay route and make him a starter. It works perfect for the Blue Jays, why the Mariners or other teams can’t do that also?
by LCT on Dec 13, 2008 8:02 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
because he is small and he doesn't have the starter stuff
i was about to argue this, but it’s so obvious i’ll just let someone else say it later
by IHateMitchMustain on Dec 13, 2008 4:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Heilman wanted to start or be traded!
He can probably put up similar numbers as a 2 million starter to what Silva can at 12 million when Silva is at his best.
Mike Newman
baseballhandyman.com
by Baseball Handyman on Dec 13, 2008 8:17 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
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