Community Prospect List: #75
by King Billy Royal on Nov 26, 2008 8:49 PM EST
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PrintAfter 323 votes the winner is Jeremy Jeffress with 15% of the vote. Chris Perez will be removed from the poll as he failed to achieve at least 5% of the vote. Jeff Niemann and Michael Burgess will be added to the poll.
1. MATT WIETERS - C (Baltimore)
2. DAVID PRICE - SP (Tampa Bay)
3. JASON HEYWARD - OF (Atlanta)
4. TRAVIS SNIDER - OF (Toronto)
5. MADISON BUMGARNER - SP (San Francisco)
6. COLBY RASMUS - OF (St. Louis)
7. CAMERON MAYBIN - OF (Florida)
8. TREVOR CAHILL - SP (Oakland)
9. NEFTALI FELIZ - SP (Texas)
10. MATT LAPORTA - 1B/OF/DH (Cleveland)
11. MIKE MOUSTAKAS - 3B (Kansas City)
12. TIM ALDERSON - SP (San Francisco)
13. PEDRO ALVAREZ - 3B (Pittsburgh)
14. RICK PORCELLO - SP (Detroit)
15. DEXTER FOWLER - OF (Colorado)
16. BRETT ANDERSON - SP (Oakland)*
17. DEREK HOLLAND - SP (Texas)
18. ANDREW McCUTCHEN - OF (Pittsburgh)
19. BUSTER POSEY - C (San Francisco)
20. CHRIS TILLMAN - SP (Baltimore)
21. LARS ANDERSON - 1B (Boston)
22. JUSTIN SMOAK - 1B (Texas)
23. THOMAS HANSON - SP (Atlanta)
24. ELVIS ANDRUS - SS (Texas)
25. ANGEL VILLALONA - 1B (San Francisco)
26. JHOULYS CHACIN - SP (Colorado)
27. BRIAN MATUSZ - SP (Baltimore)
28. ERIC HOSMER - 1B (Kansas City)
29. TIM BECKHAM - SS (Tampa Bay)
30. MAX RAMIREZ - C/1B (Texas)
31. JARROD PARKER - SP (Arizona)
32. MICHAEL STANTON - OF (Florida)
33. MAT GAMEL - 3B (Milwaukee)
34. JESUS MONTERO - C (New York-AL)
35. BRETT WALLACE - 3B (St. Louis)
36. JORDAN SCHAFER - OF (Atlanta)
37. WADE DAVIS - SP (Tampa Bay)
38. LOGAN MORRISON - 1B (Florida)
39. CARLOS SANTANA - C (Cleveland)
40. FERNANDO MARTINEZ - OF (New York-NL)
41. JAMES McDONALD - SP (Los Angeles-NL)
42. JEREMY HELLICKSON - SP (Tampa Bay)
43. JOSH VITTERS - 3B (Chicago-NL)
44. YONDER ALONSO - 1B (Cincinnati)
45. TAYLOR TEAGARDEN - C (Texas)
46. FREDDIE FREEMAN - 1B (Atlanta)
47. GORDON BECKHAM - SS (Chicago-AL)
48. BRETT CECIL - SP (Toronto)
49. ALCIDES ESCOBAR - SS (Milwaukee)
50. JORDAN ZIMMERMANN - SP (Washington)
51. CHRIS CARTER - 1B/DH (Oakland)
52. CARLOS TRIUNFEL - SS (Seattle)
53. AUSTIN JACKSON - OF (New York-AL)
54. BEN REVERE - OF (Minnesota)
55. MICHAEL BOWDEN - SP (Boston)
56. TYLER FLOWERS - C (Atlanta)
57. ADRIAN CARDENAS - SS (Oakland)
58. REID BRIGNAC - SS (Tampa Bay)
59. JAKE ARRIETA - SP (Baltimore)
60. JORDAN WALDEN - SP (Los Angeles-AL)
61. MICHAEL MAIN - SP (Texas)
62. WILMER FLORES - SS (New York-NL)
63. MATT DOMINGUEZ - 3B (Florida)
64. MICHAEL SAUNDERS - OF (Seattle)
65. DESMOND JENNINGS - OF (Tampa Bay)
66. CARLOS CARRASCO - SP (Philadelphia)
67. AARON CUNNINGHAM - OF (Oakland)
68. J.P. ARENCIBIA - C (Toronto)
69. GIO GONZALEZ - SP (Oakland)
70. PHILLIPPE AUMONT - SP (Seattle)
71. JEFF SAMARDZIJA - SP/RP (Chicago-NL)
72. MICHAEL INOA - SP (Oakland)
73. AARON HICKS - OF (Minnesota)
74. JEREMY JEFFRESS - SP (Milwaukee)
CANDIDATES - Martin Perez, Jose Tabata, Daniel Cortes, Angel Salome, Gorkys Hernandez, Greg Halman, Jacob McGee, Aaron Poreda, Kyle Blanks, Todd Frazier, Jeff Niemann, Michael Burgess
TESTERS - David Cooper(63-0%), Nick Noonan(64-3%), Christopher Marrero(65-1%), Dellin Betances (66-2%), Adam Miller (67-3%), Kila Ka'aihue (67-3%), Ivan DeJesus, Neftali Soto, Michael Taylor, Vincent Mazzaro, Jason Donald(69-4%), Jonathan Niese, Matt Moore, Andrew Lambo(70-4%), Beau Mills(3%), Daryl Jones(73-4%), Nick Weglarz(73-4%) & Scott Elbert, Brad Holt, Chris Perez (74-43%)
NOTE: I have listed by each tester the last time they were on a poll and the percentage of votes they obtained. This should help us with selecting who should be placed back on the poll etc
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Neftali Soto
19 years old
3B
Hit .340 this year (.326 in the Midwest League)
Slugged .558 (.500 in the Midwest League)
Has a ton of power potential
Doesn’t strike out much at all (less than 16% of the time he steps to the plate)
His only downside is he doesn’t walk much, but if you put the ball in play as much as he does, with the power that he has, his average is going to continue to he up there, which will lessen the impact the lack of walks has. Add in that the more power he shows with his lack of strikeouts, the more he will be pitches around and the more walks he will get.
He is my guy from this point forward until he is on.
Hey Dirt McGirt
I will try to remember to get him on the poll tomorrow night.
"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."
-Jonathan Swift
by King Billy Royal on Nov 26, 2008 8:54 PM EST up reply actions
If...
that’s a beanecounters reference, Doug’s not Dirt McGirt. I am. (Which one are you?)
If it’s not a BC reference and you have no idea what I’m talking about, nevermind.
The correct answer is............'no idea what you are talking about'
"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."
-Jonathan Swift
by King Billy Royal on Nov 26, 2008 9:20 PM EST up reply actions
Joe Dirt Reference
could also mean Ol’ Dirty Bastard of Wu Tang Clan.
by METSMETSMETS on Nov 26, 2008 10:56 PM EST up reply actions
Bingo
You have to love Dirt McGirt looking up all the girls skirts!!!!!!!
"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."
-Jonathan Swift
by King Billy Royal on Nov 26, 2008 11:14 PM EST up reply actions
You might be more convincing if...
You didn’t use the exact same argument each time. Especially since all you do is vote for your reds.
If you don’t convince people using that, use new arguments.
Really?
Tough to do since there have only been two guys even put on the polls from the Reds and I voted for a whole lot of guys before Alonso got on, about 30 or so guys.
In these I have voted for Brett Cecil twice, Austin Jackson three times, Tyler Flowers four times, Matt Dominguez, Aaron Cunningham and Daniel Cortes and those are the only ones I can see.
As for new arguments, no one has really opposed Soto in a reply to my comment so I haven’t really changed an argument yet.
Soto doesn't get on before Stubbs, Valaika and Frazier, and both probably are not getting on.
by byronlhsdrmr on Nov 27, 2008 1:38 AM EST up reply actions
Let me ask why
Personally, I have Soto at #2 in the Reds system, followed by Stubbs, Frazier and Valaika in that order. I think Soto has a special bat, even with his lack of walks at this point in question. He has a TON of power and the ability to hit for a high average due to the lack of strikeouts and he can stick at 3B with some work on his feet. I can see him being an Andre Dawson/Carlos Lee type of hitter in terms of results, except while playing third base.
Thats how I view Soto anyways. What do you view him as, and what about that puts him behind those guys for you?
That view
has to be his absolute 100th percentile outcome I think. If that’s truly what your basing your rankings on, then sure I understand putting him 2nd. But I also think that you’re setting the bar way too high. I posted part of the BP writeup on him the other day. The has work to do if he’s going to stay at 3B, so that has to be taken into account somewhere. I love the potential he has, but he’s only played 52 games above Rookie Ball. I wouldn’t rank him ahead of Frazier or Valaika at all, both of those guys I think will be able to be big league regulars. Stubbs I could maybe see behind Soto, because I’m not sold that he’ll hit enough to be more than just an outstanding glove in CF, but even that still has lots value. Anyway, I think Frazier is a guy that should make the end of the list, but that’s probably it from the Reds the rest of the way. Soto is 3-4 years away, and he’s not one of those ridiculous ARL guys that so many around here drool over, so I’d say temper the expectations a bit for now, and wait and see what he does in 2009 and maybe even 2010 before going too overboard with him.
"So's your mom"-David Sloane
Scouting reports count for what?
His scouting reports say he will hit for average and he has lots of power. He went out and hit .340 this year and slugged .558 this year. Soto is going to start in High A next year and very likely finish the year in AA. If thats 3-4 years away, then we are just going to have to disagree.
In A ball
Where he played at age 19 this year against people his own age, he batted .324 with a .500 Slugging percentage over 216 ABs. I have no idea why you add his numbers in Rookie ball, where he played against people younger than him in his second tour in the league. In A ball, his numbers were strong enough to stand on their own merits, though he was helped by a .364 BABIP. He is a very good prospect, but not that good considering how far away he is. It’s possible he’ll come up in 2 years, if everything goes right, but the likelihood is he won’t make it for at least 3 if not 4. When he does, he appears to be a guy who could hit for high average and very good power – maybe a Mat Gamel type. Or maybe not – there’s an awful lot that can go wrong – and right – in those years
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by OldProspects on Nov 27, 2008 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
There are a lot of 19 year olds in A ball?
Mat Gamel comps for Neftali Soto? Really?
Gamel didn’t show any power until he was 21 and in Low A. Gamel also strikes out more than Soto does and doesn’t play negative defense at every position on the field.
I think you have a terrible idea of the relative age level of competition. In ‘rookie ball’ you state he was playing against people younger than him. In the Pioneer League, where he played 2 weeks, he was the 13th youngest player in the league at age 19. Once he got into the Midwest League, he was the 10th youngest player in the league.
Also, it wasn’t his second tour of the Pioneer League. He spent his entire season last year in the GCL before going down with an elbow injury in the final month of the year. This year he began in the Pioneer League, tore the league apart for 2 weeks, then was promoted to Dayton.
As for how far away he is, he is ‘far’ I guess in terms of the league he finished in, but there are also 3 guys in the top 11 that are just as ‘far’ away as Soto. Still, he isn’t that far off when you think he is going to finish the season in AA.
Prefer Stubbs
I prefer Stubbs, because I like his offensive ceiling and I love his floor. From all the reports I’ve heard on his defense, he’d be a top ten defensive CF right now. There’s sort of a limit to how bad he can be.
agree
Absolutely great defense, and has a high floor. If he can hit anywhere near the power he was once projected to have he will be a very good player.
by byronlhsdrmr on Nov 27, 2008 4:18 PM EST up reply actions
Well
if he starts in A+, then spends a year in AA, and a year in AAA, that’s three years. Much faster than that is rushing him unless he really explodes. He’s had 52 games above Rookie ball and you think he should be finishing 2009 in AA? That’s pretty damn agressive. His luck and park adjusted line in Dayton was .310/.329/.472/.801, good numbers for a 19 year old kid, but not so dominant that he should absolutely start in High A. I’d let him start back in Dayton and then let him move up to A+ later in the year. He needs to refine his plate discipline, and rushing him up the ladder isn’t going to get that done.
"So's your mom"-David Sloane
+1
I think the guy should really be on the list before Frasier if we are going to start talking Reds Bias…
by team name deleted on Nov 27, 2008 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
Went with Blanks.
BTW, since McGee is on the poll, how about a tester for FDLS?
Never, Never, NEVER give up
Sorry to burst the bubble, but McGee is significantly ahead of DLS
They have similar stuff but McGee has a much solider track record.
Call me a nutjob if you will, but I have Arnold Leon ahead of DLS on my A’s list right now.
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
Second on Blanks. How is this guy 60+ spots below LaPorta?
It's not the results, it's how you look going about those results -- Tim McCarver
by WaddellCanseco on Nov 27, 2008 12:45 AM EST up reply actions
Kind of a motley crew
This isn’t a very inspiring list. Daryl Jones would be more appealing than any of these guys.
Little-known fact
Gregory Halman doesn’t like being called Greg.
Little known fact
Cacti have only 2 senses: Taste and sight.
by METSMETSMETS on Nov 26, 2008 10:57 PM EST up reply actions
Gorky Hernandez doesn't hit
.348/.387 in high A. .344/.391 in low a. Ok, he’s young. But he has done nothing to warrant top 100 in my mind.
Still better than Tabata... but, yeah, not really top 100 material
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
where are his fans?
28 votes and no one attempts to counter the argument the kid hasn’t hit yet. Tabata is at least younger and had a nice bounceback in Pirates system, albeit in a small sample.
Injuries
Yes they are a part of the game but if you look at what Gorkys did before he had run into some hamstring issues you would see that he was on his way to another break out year. Kid has all the tools to be a dynamic leadoff/Centerfielder in baseball. As a Brave fan, hearing reports from our organization I firmly believe that he belongs on this list.
another breakout year
I think he needs his first breakout year.
He was very good in rookie ball at 18 but it is rookie ball. He was named midwest league mvp at 19, but his numbers weren’t that great, except for stolen bases. He had a decent batting eye, and his slugging wasn’t very high, but the midwest league is tough. This year’s stats were very similar to his low A stats, except lower stolen base total, but like you said, hamstring issues. And he gets good reviews for his D.
Not really top 100 material to me, like Paul Thomas said. But clearly he could take a step up. I’d rather go with a guy like Jason Donald now then Gorkys.
Perez
Lost Perez who i voted for last 2 polls, so I went with Tabata.
Go Pirates!!!
by cool hand Charlie on Nov 26, 2008 11:52 PM EST reply actions
You have to keep voting for him!!!
This only works if you stand by your vote.
I vote ChrisPerez also
Should Chris Perez even be eligible?
I thought he was over the rookie innings pitched limit?
Vogt early, Vogt often.
still eligible
But good point that he has proven time in the majors.
A very good example of the same in Jenks who was ranked 26 by BA after his first season
Hmmm
Been voting for Cortes for a few. I wanted Halman a while ago too. Blanks and Burgess deserve to be here too. And yet, I look at some of the guys on this list who have either no scouting reports with good numbers, good scouting with bad numbers, or big paychecks and everything else is unknown (Inoa)- and I wonder…..I mean honestly, somebody gave me crap about how important K% is, and while Halman is only 21 and oozes skills, we’re evaluating babips and such, while the guy busts out numbers. Yet, Arencibia, is on already. I know harder position, ok/makes him sooo much better…Yeah, a guy with a cannon arm and ability to play all 3 OF positions must be less valuable. Dan Cortes is accomplished, and he has updside, how the hell is he behind Michael Main? Blanks and Burgess belong on soon, for different reasons. C;mon guys, do you all honestly even look at the polls and have a good read on everyone?
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