but theyve traded guys they had control over for multiples year for guys they control for less years at expensive prices… thats a pretty big waste of assets on a non-contender.

If Jacobs or Crisp were any sort of premium players… sure…but theyre below average options…

If they are trying to build around Butler, then they would not have traded for Jacobs and added to that logjam.

Take a look at Crisp’s numbers before he came to the Red Sox. I just think he was one of those guys who could not handle the pressure of Boston, and never recouped after that finger injury. He could very easily be a .280/15/70 with 30 steals guy .355+OBP and a possible gold glove defense. This is the best CF’er the Royals have had in a while.

As for Ramirez, as a Red Sox fan, I want to see him first in a pressure enviroment. He has not had to deal with that yet. I have seem relievers come and go, but his stuff seems solid. I would not throw him in the 8th inning role right away however. Keep Masterson/Okajima there and let Ramirez and Delcarmen battle it out for the 7th inning role

The other is free for two years and below market for another two others.

I’d say their contracts have roughly equal value once you account for the fact that if Soria’s is a lot less risky by virtue of being year-to-year rather than guaranteed.

And it was huge need. I’m not a huge fan of Crisp as a starter, but he’s a big upgrade over Gathright, who actually started 74 games for this team last season.

KC is a better team after this trade. One thing Moore has seemed to do a decent job of is finding some pitching. They still need more, but that’s one area where he has had some successes. Dealing from the bullpen to fill out the weaker spots on the team with at least average talent isn’t a bad strategy.

I’m guessing you went to Fangraphs and looked at the bottom line, which is ’09’s Marcel projections.

Isn’t that asking a little much? I’d get a new catcher if my pitcher was striking out 9 an inning anyways.

for a reliever they had control over cheaply through 2012(13?).

I think KC may have come out slightly ahead on a value basis… but it doesnt make much sense in the context of their team. The problem last year was the offense. Now theyve ensured theyre going to have an even worse batter in CF… and likely push Dejesus to the corner? Jacobs at 1B seemingly shooting for a .330 OBP?? The Royals offense could be epically bad next year.

I wondered if this would allow the Royals to eat half of Guillen’s contract and maybe move him in a deal. I know he’s not going to be extremely desirable, but at about $6M a year on a two year deal I think someone would be interested, right? My thinking is with Crisp and DeJesus in CF and RF most likely, then you could probably get by with the lesser of 4 evils in LF between Butler/Shealy/Kila/Jacobs. One goes to 1B, one to DH, one to the bench then. I would think you’d have a better offensive club that way, wouldn’t you?

and a good thing. it’s cool that people are talking about this trade. but look at some of the things they’re saying…

I still say Dayton Moore is on his way out. Jacobs and Crisp… you spent the time after the season ended analyzing your team and these are the solutions you came up with??? Trade two moderately valuable relievers for two below average offensive players at their positions? Really??

These trades are absolutely idiotic.

i can’t even begin to tell you how unfair this deal is. the red sox get one of the best relievers in the AL and what do the royals get……they get an overpaid 4th-OF type……if this were a fantasy baseball trade, then i would vote for it to be vetoed…..

it strikes me as a totally reasonable trade for both teams.

There are lots of guys hanging around with Coco’s skill set or close enough. Guys like Ramirez are a little harder to find.

Rivera started as a starter. The Yankees felt he couldn’t compete as a starter (see his 5.51 ERA as a rookie) and moved him to the pen.

He’s still the same guy who had an .800 OPS with speed as a 24 year old in Cleveland. If he reverts to that (he’s still only 29), then he would be a solidly above average CF

If Boston adds a real 4th OF, when Drew goes down you’ll have a decent bat out there instead of Crisp. :-/

Basically everything I’ve read (outside of the shrill reactions at the top of this thread) seem to see it as a trade that benefited at least KC. So maybe if everyone is wrong….

’Course, this is baseball, so watch Ramirez turn into a top-teir closer and Crisp break his leg in ST. :-)