Community Prospect List: #6

Cahill

GB rates + K rates are hard to ignore. Only 20 years old and reached AA doing well in a hitters league despite being fairly inexperienced pitching wise.

by jfish26101 on Oct 21, 2008 10:37 AM EDT reply actions

Maybin gets my vote

again

I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?

by the pinstripes on Oct 21, 2008 10:38 AM EDT reply actions

+1 Maybin again for me

Go Pirates!!!

by cool hand Charlie on Oct 21, 2008 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions

Moustakas, Montero & Tillman

are next up for testers

I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?

by the pinstripes on Oct 21, 2008 10:39 AM EDT reply actions

Montero?

A little early for him I think. I have him in the 20s at the earliest.

by supermets on Oct 21, 2008 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions

Cahill

I like the combination of him reaching a relatively advanced level and having a very good season.

Psycho killer, qu'est-ce que c'est?

by shikantaza on Oct 21, 2008 10:43 AM EDT reply actions

SNTS

I think the 2008 draft should be better represented in the tester rotation: T Beckham, Posey, Matusz, Smoak, Hosmer.

by dkdc on Oct 21, 2008 10:58 AM EDT reply actions

As a Rays fan

Beckham belongs nowhere near this high. I can see Posey, Matusz and Smoak in the top 20, but Beckham and Hosmer are a stretch.

Vogt early, Vogt often.

by Brickhaus on Oct 21, 2008 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions

I agree that Beckham should not be, but if Alvarez is in this mix, there’s no reason why Hosmer, Smoak and others should then also be considered. Alvarez was not necessarily the best bat from the ’08 class (especially when talking position scarcity), so if Alvarez continues on these lists then really Smoak and Hosmer (arguably the other top power bats) and Beckham (best overall tools) should also be considered.

by RoyalsFan4Life on Oct 21, 2008 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions

Rasmus

until he gets on

by slurve on Oct 21, 2008 11:58 AM EDT reply actions

+1

by wolviex18 on Oct 21, 2008 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions

Rasmus

Yes, he had a poor year. But he stayed on the field when many many players would have been sidelined. He has the tools, and he’ll bounce back in a big way.

Remember: baseball guys... baseball...

by JD Sussman on Oct 21, 2008 12:00 PM EDT reply actions

Cont'd Thanks

to Pinstripes and King Billy for all their hard work on the lists. It’s great to see the debate between people as to why certain prospects should be ahead of one another, w/out resorting to personal attacks (as has been done in the past). Keep the debate ragin’.

by RoyalsFan4Life on Oct 21, 2008 12:47 PM EDT reply actions

Alderson deservers his shot

Accidentally not thedude925 anymore. I do hate this new name.

by wildthang on Oct 21, 2008 2:31 PM EDT reply actions

or just deserves

Accidentally not thedude925 anymore. I do hate this new name.

by wildthang on Oct 21, 2008 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions

Is it me or do these all seem like B+ prospects?

Accidentally not thedude925 anymore. I do hate this new name.

by wildthang on Oct 21, 2008 2:32 PM EDT reply actions

Apparently it's just you

I’d put all of these guys except Porcello in the A range.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 21, 2008 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions

agreed

although porcello would make the grade as well.

I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?

by the pinstripes on Oct 21, 2008 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions

+1

by slurve on Oct 21, 2008 4:54 PM EDT up reply actions

I agree 100%

I think its just a poor crop of prospects in general.

#269

by mrmetaa on Oct 21, 2008 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions

this coming from a met fan doesn’t surprise me .. i kid! i kid!

p.s. is it me or does the “meet the mets” song sound like it belongs in a carnival type setting? everytime i see mr. met i just crack up. of course, one could argue that the mets are synonymous with a carnival show but i digress. i hope they ditch that song next yr. when they move into their new park. i think that would be best.

meet the mets, meet my bulldog ball. .. :-)

I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?

by the pinstripes on Oct 21, 2008 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions

classic

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zTLmDuhV3AQ

I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?

by the pinstripes on Oct 21, 2008 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions

I do think the hitters are thin this year

But the pool of elite pitching prospects is as deep as ever.

by dkdc on Oct 21, 2008 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions

I feel the opposite

I like the hitters more than the pitchers. I think LaPorta has a game-changing type of bat and in the past 7 months or so I have become a real big fan of Fowler. Maybin still has a lot of tools, although I am still skeptical about him right now. I like both Heyward and Snyder, although I thought Snyder should have been #3.

As for pitchers, I like a lot of these guys, just not for Top 8 prospects. With the exceptions of Price and Cahill, none of these guys have been really tested in the high minors. Oh, and Anderson… forgot about him. But I see him with limited MLB potential. Just not a fan.

I am one of the few that views “likeliness of reaching the majors” as equally important as a player’s ceiling. So, it’s hard for me to get too excited over any of these LoA and HiA pitchers until I have seen what they can do at higher levels.

"My mom always taught me it's better to laugh at yourself than to laugh at others. She was so wrong. ;)" -Pedrophile

by Boxkutter on Oct 21, 2008 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions

+1

I remember last year when everyone loved McGee. Then when the prospect books came out, many discussed how he is able to get by in Low and High A with a fastball and it is doubtful he would be able to when he advances. I would prefer to see these A Ball pitchers ini higher levels before getting to thrilled.

"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."
-Jonathan Swift

by King Billy Royal on Oct 21, 2008 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions

Cahill is the best listed pitcher

I would even take him over Bumgarner at this point.

by tdot mariner fan on Oct 21, 2008 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions

So what you're saying

Is that Hanson’s domination of High-A, AA, and now the AFL pushes him ahead of a lot of these guys in your eyes?

by mraver on Oct 21, 2008 5:47 PM EDT up reply actions

+1

I would agree, but also include Feliz and Anderson with Cahill and Price, as they both pitched in Double A too. I think Feliz had more Double A innings than Cahill and Anderson though.

by RoyalsFan4Life on Oct 21, 2008 4:52 PM EDT up reply actions

You're right, he did.

I always forget that Feliz moved up to AA and continued to pitch well.

"My mom always taught me it's better to laugh at yourself than to laugh at others. She was so wrong. ;)" -Pedrophile

by Boxkutter on Oct 21, 2008 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions

Tillman spent the whole year at AA

by dkdc on Oct 21, 2008 5:19 PM EDT up reply actions

I know...

I said last offseason when my Mariners traded him away that I thught he was a bigger loss than Jones was in the Bedard deal. But I don’t see Tillman as being Top 10 right now… maybe closer to the 18-25 range. I like his ERA, K/9, and H/9. What I don’t like is that he could not average even 5 innings per start, and averaged around 4.5BB/9. I also don’t like the fact that he is a flyball pitcher.

"My mom always taught me it's better to laugh at yourself than to laugh at others. She was so wrong. ;)" -Pedrophile

by Boxkutter on Oct 21, 2008 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions

they went to the olympics which skewed their innings totals

thats why cahill wasnt eligible for BA’s texas league top 20

by Asfan4ever723 on Oct 22, 2008 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions

BoxKutter....

Why do you see Anderson with limited MLB potential? That’s just insane to me.

Anderson is so ridiculously underrated…it’s not even funny.

Never, Never, NEVER give up

by hero66 on Oct 22, 2008 12:18 AM EDT up reply actions

Tillman tester

Voted for Rasmus here, the injury plaqued season has taken little away from his potential in my opinion. His perseverence through and adverse situation this year will help him adjust better when he attempts to transition to the MLB sometime in 2009.

Also, I think it is time Tillman be included in the polls, he belongs on the cusp of the top 10 in my opinion. I really do not see Fowler landing in the top 10-15 at all, he should be given a run again a few polls from now.

by tdot mariner fan on Oct 21, 2008 4:14 PM EDT reply actions

Tillman

Tillman will be getting a tester in the next poll.

"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."
-Jonathan Swift

by King Billy Royal on Oct 21, 2008 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions

+1

I think I remember reading that BA would have Tillman in the 11-16 range, overall.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Oct 21, 2008 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions

find it funny

that KG said today in his chat that Heyward was not a top 5 prospect. Did someone from this forum ask that question?

by uwbadger on Oct 21, 2008 5:05 PM EDT reply actions

+1

and that Alvarez was a top 25 propsect, no mention of any top 10 consideration.

by RoyalsFan4Life on Oct 21, 2008 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions

Bill Ballew

said in his sally league top 20 chat that “one wouldn’t get laughed out of the room for suggesting it”.

I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?

by the pinstripes on Oct 21, 2008 5:15 PM EDT up reply actions

You could say the same about 15-20 guys

by dkdc on Oct 21, 2008 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions

Agreed

I personally don’t care what Sickels, Goldstein, Callis, etc, have to say when coming up with our prospect list. If we wanted to have the same list as them, we would just wait for the books to come out. Personally, I don’t think that any of the guys currently in the poll would look out of place in a top 10 list.

"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."
-Jonathan Swift

by King Billy Royal on Oct 21, 2008 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions

i agree

I was just pointing out that we put Heyward in the top 5 and two days later someone asks the question in his chat.

by uwbadger on Oct 21, 2008 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions

+1 sorta

I completely agree with your first sentence. We need to have our own list. Also, I agree with the Ballew quote that Heyward is not an outlandish Top 5 player (even though I think of him more as a typical 5-8 range).

"My mom always taught me it's better to laugh at yourself than to laugh at others. She was so wrong. ;)" -Pedrophile

by Boxkutter on Oct 21, 2008 5:32 PM EDT up reply actions

+1

He would be around #8 on my personal list, but I don’t think #3 is too outlandish.

"When a true genius appears in the world, you may know him by this sign, that the dunces are all in confederacy against him."
-Jonathan Swift

by King Billy Royal on Oct 21, 2008 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions

Here's the exchange

Jeff (Western Mass): Is Jason Heyward overrated if he is listed as a top 5 prospect? To be sure, he put up very good numbers in his first full season, but Montero, Freeman, Moustakas, and Stanton all put up significantly better power numbers at the same age and level, and none of these guys is likely to sniff the top 10. Thanks for chatting.

Kevin Goldstein: I have no idea if somebody is listing Heyward as one of the top five prospects in the game, but yes, that’s a little wacky. He’s an elite prospect, but Top Five? Don’t see it.

I said at the time that I thought he was rated too high in our poll, but I don’t think any of the other guys listed are near Hewyard except maybe Moustacos. Rather, I put him behind some of the guys we’re voting in now, like Snider and Rasmus.

by mraver on Oct 21, 2008 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions

+1

i said the same thing. dont know where all the hype over him comes from. it’s not his numbers, that’s for sure as freeman had better. probably just being the top prospect on a popular team, first round pick, keeps him high in the public consciousness. #3 was ridiculously too high.

by son.of.sourman on Oct 21, 2008 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions

It's not about numbers

There are a ton of guys that have better numbers. If we based this list solely on numbers then dallas macpherson or Kila Kahuiie (sp?) would rank among the elite.

We, as a community, are not scouts, so all we can go by is by what the professional scouts and ppl who do this for a living say. Scouts say Heyward has a huge skillset, both in terms of projection and athletic ability, so when voting in the polls for these players, that is one (and probably the most significant) factor that should be taken into consideration.

by RoyalsFan4Life on Oct 21, 2008 6:34 PM EDT up reply actions

looks like brett anderson & rick porcello need to come off the list. not a huge fan of anderson anyway.

I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?

by the pinstripes on Oct 21, 2008 5:44 PM EDT reply actions

I don't get it, I really don't

What does Anderson NOT do well? Plus stuff, plus makeup, great stats, young, projectable. The guy was pitching in AAA, not to mention for Team USA, by age 20.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 21, 2008 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions

I agree with you

that he has really performed well. I think most ppl look at his upside/ceiling and see him more as a #2 type, whereas guys like Bumgarner or Feliz have the upside/ceiling of a #1. I think there’s a lot of ppl that factor upside/potential when they are voting on these lists.

by RoyalsFan4Life on Oct 21, 2008 6:02 PM EDT up reply actions

OK, that's completely ridiculous

You know what other lefty has a 93 MPH fastball, plus control and two plus offspeed pitches? Johan Santana.

Yes, that would be the best pitcher in baseball over the last five seasons.

As far as I can tell, most people’s idea of “upside” is “how fast your fastball is”, which is retarded.

I’m not saying the guy is the next Santana, before someone accuses me of this.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 21, 2008 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions

anderson

i should say that i do like anderson and i would rate him highly. what i was trying to say is that i wouldn’t place him amongst the top 5 pitching prospects. it seems as though you think highly enough of him to place him there. i disagree. that’s what i meant to convey. sorry for the confusion.

I heard Tim Lincecum will win 1 Cy Young & 11 Tim Lincecums. Question is, how many Cole Hamels will he win?

by the pinstripes on Oct 21, 2008 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions

Maybin has tools out the wazoo

But for some reason I’m not sold on him putting it all together

by NateHST on Oct 21, 2008 6:11 PM EDT reply actions

How is Heyward so high?

For example, Montero did better this year in the same league sharing the same age. He probably won’t even be top 20.

by schmosterballs92 on Oct 21, 2008 6:33 PM EDT reply actions

It's not just about numbers folks (see above)

There are a ton of guys that have better numbers. If we based this list solely on numbers then dallas macpherson or Kila Kahuiie (sp?) would rank among the elite.

We, as a community, are not scouts, so all we can go by is by what the professional scouts and ppl who do this for a living say. Scouts say Heyward has a huge skillset, both in terms of projection and athletic ability, so when voting in the polls for these players, that is one (and probably the most significant) factor that should be taken into consideration.

by RoyalsFan4Life on Oct 21, 2008 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions

Last year's list

To show how much prospect status can change from year to year, here are the still-eligible players from our list from last year (which pooped out at #67). Most look at least OK but some of them look pretty bad now (Lillibridge, Guerra, Antonelli):

Colby Rasmus 3
Cameron Maybin 7
David Price 9
Jake McGee 11
Travis Snider 13
Matt Wieters 15
Andrew McCutchen 17 (tie)
Wade Davis 19
Reid Brignac 20 (tie)
Rick Porcello 23
Matt LaPorta 26
Mike Moustakas 27
Chris Marrero 28
Fernando Martinez 29
Matt Antonelli 30
Desmond Jennings 31
Jason Heyward 33
Fautino De Los Santos 34
Angel Villalona 36
Gio Gonzalez 37
Carlos Triunfel 39
Jordan Schafer 41
Adam Miller 42
Nick Adenhart 43
Austin Jackson 45
Eric Hurley 46
Jose Tabata 47
Lars Anderson 49
Jarrod Parker 53
Taylor Teagarden 54
Deolis Guerra 56
Neil Walker 57
Josh Vitters 58
Ross Detwiler 59
Hank Conger 60
Elvis Andrus 61
Jordan Walden 63
Mike Burgess 64
Brett Anderson 66
Brent Lillibridge 67

Cant help wondering how this year’s list will look next year.

I went Rasmus here.

by rhd on Oct 21, 2008 8:05 PM EDT reply actions

Strikeouts

Aren’t you guys the least bit concerned about Maybin’s propensity to strike out? A guy who OPSes .840 and strikes out more than an AB a game doesn’t look all that promising. I see more Mike Cameron/Chris Young than I do anything earth shattering. Give me LaPorta any day.

by Fanon on Oct 22, 2008 2:11 AM EDT reply actions

Mike Cameron in his prime was an underappreciated star player

15 RAA offense, 10 RAA defense— that’s an all-star, methinks. But the voters don’t know how to judge defense or adjust for the crazy pitcher’s parks Cameron has played in for his entire career.

Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.

by PaulThomas on Oct 22, 2008 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions