Garza/Slowey/Terry Ryan

by design28 on May 28, 2007 9:23 AM EDT

This has become a bizarre siuation ... first Garza was seemingly banished from the major league roster in Spring Training after simply OWNING hitters ... then his numbers are hurt in AAA b/c he was asked to work on his secondary stuff (and being disappointed) etc ...

Slowey comes out like a house on fire in '07 ... Garza spouts off on Saturday:

http://www.twincities.com/ci_5992669?source=most_viewed

Then today (Monday), Slowey is (most probably) promoted to take Ortiz's rotation job? Don't get me wrong, Slowey has been ACES this year, but doesn't this look at least a little punitive on the Twins' part? Sheesh, the Reds should call Ryan and see if they could take Garza off the Twins' hands for Dunn ...

Thoughts? Anyone else with some insight? Is Garza just being immature? Has Ryan acted like this before?

Of course, Silva and Bonser have been mediocre this year, too, so maybe Garza's time will be soon enough ...

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thoughts

I'm not a Terry Ryan fan so I want that out there right away.

I can't imagine either Slowey or Garza worse than Ortiz anymore than I thought Baker would be worse than Ponson.

I think Garza got a taste of the big time last year, the results weren't good but you're right he kills in ST and now he's been by-passed twice so he spouted off and frankly in the Twins Org that is not a good thing for a kid to do.

That said, it's nice to have him in line when Silva heads south or if Slowey doesn't quite pan out. Either way it's great to see Ponson gone and Ortiz penned.

It takes Ryan a month or so to realize the error of his winter mistakes (see last year with Castro and Batista manning the left side of the infield).

I won't get married until the Red Sox win the World Series. AGAIN!!

by Shep on May 28, 2007 9:40 AM EDT reply actions

Garza's reaction

I think in most professional organizations, sports or otherwise, handling a setback with "I'm doing it my way, I know what I'm doing" is a good way to find yourself getting passed over for promotions.

You would think instead of making excuses for his lack of success last season in the bigs, he would take the suggestions and do what he can to incorporate them. His words and attitude proves he has done that begrudgingly at best.

Obviously he has been distracted while pitching this season, he admits that. Could that be the reason for his struggles? Maybe a greater enthusiasm for growing and getting better instead of pouting and blaming others would result in better performance and the promotion he is hoping for. You can be disappointed, but you can't let it linger.

by spidurfan on May 28, 2007 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions

garza's reaction

I wasn't the most mature at Garza's age either, but I knew enough not to pop off about my boss. I'm sure he's ready to pitch in the majors, but I don't know if he's ready to exist in the majors.

Not to mention, there was some logic to Baker getting the first call over Garza. The team deferred to Ponson and Ortiz this spring because they're "proven veterans," and Baker was next in line before either Garza or Slowey last year. If he's passed over for Slowey, fine -- but don't get upset before the actual slight.

That said ... this organization is famous for playing mind games with young talent. I'm not necessarily taking Garza's side, but no team that counts on homegrown players this much should treat them this carelessly. Ponson and Ortiz will be two mistakes that might screw up the franchise itself, not just the season.

by whichthat on May 28, 2007 10:50 AM EDT up reply actions

Irony ...

Read this intro paragraph on his profile after being drafted:

http://twins.scout.com/2/516232.html

Paul Householder, Gary Redus, Tommy Lawless, Duane Walker ... prospects rawk!

by design28 on May 28, 2007 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions

Other pitches

The problem of relying too much on his fastball is not a new one apparently. I think they moved him through the system quickly last year hoping that would catch up to him. It didn't until he hit the major leagues. Apparently he still isn't convinced. So they are probably going to have to give him another opportunity to fail. Maybe in the fall ...

by TT @ Minor League Ball on May 28, 2007 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions

careless?

I'm not sure how sending a 23 year old back to AAA after getting bombed over the course of almost 1/3rd of a season in MLB is careless. He wasn't successful, they asked him to work on some things to make him successful. He either hasn't be willing or able to incorporate those changes. It's not like they are doing it to be spiteful, they WANT him to be successful. Asking him to spend a couple months refining his game after an extensive audition that was largely unsuccessful is completely acceptable.

Ponson was a disaster, obviously. But I bet Ryan would argue the Ramon Ortiz thing worked out well. He pitched fantastic for 1 month. He has been bad his last 5 starts. He had 3 younger guys at AAA he thought would be ready to step in about a month or two down the road when Ponson and Ortiz imploded. Had Garza done what was asked, AND did it whole-heartedly he might have been one of the two called upon. He hasn't, Baker did, and Slowey has been dominant.

To say that the franchise has been compromised is a stretch.

by spidurfan on May 28, 2007 11:42 AM EDT up reply actions

Ryan

I heard Ryan on local radio yesterday, and he would not committ to making a change with Ortiz, much less naming his replacement. However, Garza's reaction certainly did not endear him to Ryan, though he didn't call him out by name. He did say something to the effect of: when we send guys to AAA who have seen the majors, it is usually because they have things that our staff feels they need to work on to help the big club. If they aren't doing that, or showing us they can make those adjustments, they won't be back with us. He actually used Alexi Casilla as one example, but not in a negative way, saying Casilla had some rough edges with baserunning and playing defense that he was making progress with.
Bottom line: Garza doesn't help himself by being stubborn and bucking the advice of the people in a position to promote him or keep him at AAA. As any farm director or GM will tell you: we look at more than the stats-it's how you put up those numbers that we get paid to evaluate.

Anyway, the take here is that Ortiz gets sent to the pen and they call up Slowey before the end of next week at the latest.
JAS

by jasvlm on May 28, 2007 11:12 AM EDT reply actions

I think the pressure is on Ryan...

to call up Slowey anyways.

When the talk of replacing Ponson was going on, everyone was on the Twinkies to bring up Garza or Slowey. Based on performance Twins fans/media thought Slowey was the one that should get the call, but Baker was brought up.

Now that Baker's pitched fairly effectively, I think that the supporters of Slowey are putting pressure on Ryan to bring up Slowey and with good reason. His performances at AAA indicate he's ready. Whether that translates into wins at the MLB level, only time will tell, but I think Slowey's as ready as he's ever going to be.

I'm unsure how much Ryan or any GM 'listens' to fans/critics, but I do think that all things are pointing to Ortiz moving to the pen and Slowey being called up over Garza.

by NewKidInTown on May 28, 2007 11:44 AM EDT reply actions

Re:

"Of course, Silva and Bonser have been mediocre this year, too, so maybe Garza's time will be soon enough ..."

I'm sorry but I cannot disagree more with this comment. First off, let me openly admit that Bonser is one of my favorite players. That said, Bonser has not been mediocre this year. In the AL, a 3.88 ERA and 62Ks in 56 innings is not mediocre. Among starters, his ERA ranks 23rd in the AL and he ranks 8th in the AL in strikeouts.

On top of that, after getting off to a bit of a shaky start, he's been really really good over the last month. Since April 25th, he's 3-0 with an ERA of 2.314 (9th in the majors among starting pitchers over that time).

So, in other words, I would be surprised and super pissed if Bonser were to get demoted for Garza.

PS - A quick glance at Silva's statistics show he's been pretty good up until 2 weeks ago - I don't think he should be demoted yet either...

Gorkys Hernandez is my new favorite player (my tribute to VTTigers)

by Dfarth on May 28, 2007 1:55 PM EDT reply actions

Stat fight!

Respectfully, I would say that Bonser has been mediocre. His ERA and K numbers look solid (even his K:BB looks good), but an 823 OPSA v LHH / .693 OPSA v RHH (overall 755 OPSA) looks, well, mediocre.

Using VORP (no stat can encompass everything), but his VORP ranks him 134th amongst all pitchers in MLB (65th amongst AL) ... his BABIP looks a little high (.310), but his 9 HRs thus far look like trouble ... no disrespect to Boof, but he's been, well, mediocre.

Not arguing aginst current trends of the past weeks for either, but on the balance of this year, what's the argument? Both guys have been mediocre thus far. I wouldn't guess Bonser would be on his way out, but Silva has a track record only being an OK pitcher ... nothing more.

Paul Householder, Gary Redus, Tommy Lawless, Duane Walker ... prospects rawk!

by design28 on May 28, 2007 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions

Johan Santana

Has given up 12 HR so far this year...

Bonser does offer up a few too many dingers but he has actually improved his HR rate from last year - and he has really improved it over the last month. (As an aside, I don't think it's fair to totally discount "trends of the past few weeks." Many players start the season differently. It's not uncommon for a player to scorch the ball for the first few weeks - or to scuffle out of the gate. I think what happens after 2-3 weeks is much more indicative of the rest of the season than the first few weeks of the season). Since April 25th, Bonser has given up 2HR in 35Inn - which is a huge improvement and, at the very least, gives hope for the future.

Garza's splits in the minors are not THAT much better than Bonser's in the majors...794 OPSA v LHH / .623 v RHH (.700 overall)...and honestly Bonser's OPSA numbers that you listed don't seem THAT bad to me. I don't know the translation but I'd guess that Garza's numbers translate to worse MLB numbers than Bonser's.

We can agree to disagree but it would be difficult for me to classify someone who has a sub-4 ERA, who is giving up less than 1H/Inn, and who is 5th in the majors in K/9 as mediocre. I understand that there maybe some other statistics that show he isn't THAT valuable, but I'm not arguing he deserves a Cy Young...just that he doesn't deserve to be demoted. Especially when you remember that Bonser hasn't yet completeled a full season of pitching - and that he will likely improve as he gets more experience.

Gorkys Hernandez is my new favorite player (my tribute to VTTigers)

by Dfarth on May 28, 2007 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions

Bonser

Boof is about as safe as it gets right now. He has been pitching very well. The strikeouts have been very good. The walks have been cut down some. The HR have mainly been solo shots. He's pretty safe.

As a Twins fan and blogger, Slowey is the obvious choice to call up. Garza is pitching better than the stories would indicate, but he has not done anything to say that he should be brought up ahead of either Baker or Slowey. So, for now, the rotation will be Santana, Bonser, Silva, Baker, Slowey... and Garza will just have to wait. Silva was bad in May too, ,but had a very need 7.1 inning performance on Sunday, so he should be safe for awhile again.

by SethSpeaks on May 28, 2007 10:12 PM EDT up reply actions

Twins

As of a couple days ago, they were getting a 6.37 ERA in 29% of their innings and a 3.20 ERA in the other 71%.

by limozeen on May 28, 2007 2:26 PM EDT reply actions

Good for him

standing up for yourself takes some guts. screw the twins.

by wildthang on May 28, 2007 4:12 PM EDT reply actions

You're right!

"Screw the Twins! Who says I can't get by without a third pitch? Who says I can't throw my fastball past major league hitters? I'm Matt Garza!"

by Sulla on May 28, 2007 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions

just to clarify

His secondary pitches are great (curve), good (slider), and average (change). It's not even a problem how much he throws them. They just wanted him to throw them more often in the minors so that he'd be able to command them better in the majors.

by limozeen on May 28, 2007 5:33 PM EDT up reply actions

but how do you guys

think slowy will actually do? haha so much talk about what garza said, if slowey is up, does he succeed?

All hail Lincecum...the Expedition Sorcerer!

by realityconquest on May 28, 2007 5:07 PM EDT reply actions

More on Slowey.....

Looks like Ortiz has been officially demoted to the pen for long relief.

Slowey: If his command holds up as well as it has this year (in the bigs), he should do quite well(57k is not too shabby either).

Has anyone seen any projections yet?

Fan of Fenway

by bodyiq on May 28, 2007 9:14 PM EDT reply actions

Expectations

Assuming Slowey doesn't get a case of nerves, I would expect him to start out pretty well. I think the question will be what happens the second and third time teams see him. He is a control guy and he is not going to have a lot of room for error.

by TT @ Minor League Ball on May 28, 2007 11:17 PM EDT reply actions