David Price or Andrew Miller?
Two lefties, tall power pitchers, one has already made the majors while the other dominated for Team USA over the summer and is projected as the #1 overall in June.
Much has been said about Miller to this point, as many called him the best pitcher in the 2006 draft despite being picked 6th overall. The Tigers are only using him out of the pen now, though he is expected to contribute for the AL defending champs.
In 2006 Price was only a 2nd-team all-SEC pick at Vanderbilt. However, he eventually put it all together and has completely dominated ever since he found his rhythm. This could possibly be a case of a small sample size, though it is growing larger and we'll see more out of him by the time the draft rolls around.
- By 2009, which one is more successful in the majors?
- How many high school phenoms from the same two draft classes are even more successful at the major league level?
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63 comments
Comments
Miller
by Bravesin07 on Feb 17, 2007 9:50 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I'll take Price...
I also like Price's secondary pitches better.
It isn't much of a contest to me.
by templeUsox on Feb 17, 2007 10:09 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I've heard
by Dfarth on Feb 17, 2007 11:13 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Starter
They don't plan on using him as a reliever again.
by VtTigers on Feb 17, 2007 11:23 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I take Price,
by NYYLover1000 on Feb 17, 2007 11:34 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I,m not a huge miller fan,
by NYYLover1000 on Feb 17, 2007 11:36 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
To me
by NYYLover1000 on Feb 17, 2007 11:51 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Grammar
by ufoboy90 on Feb 18, 2007 12:13 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If I could have one of Lincecum or Miller...
by was385 on Feb 18, 2007 12:12 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I think Lincecum Delivery
by NYYLover1000 on Feb 18, 2007 12:32 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Why don't you like Miller?
Lincecum could end up being very good if he stays healthy and stays a starter his whole career.
But I think Miller could end up very good as well. His slider is ridiculous. His 2 seam fastball is a plus offering and so is his 4 seam fastball. I think his change up needs some work. I am not sure he will record strikeouts at the same type of rate as Lincecum. He seems to be more of a groundball pitcher that can strike out the batter as well. Which also means Miller will put a bit more pressure on the defense.
The only question with both of them is health.
by VtTigers on Feb 18, 2007 1:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If you watch Andrew Miller's
by NYYLover1000 on Feb 18, 2007 12:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No reason to use language like that
As for his motion. It reminds me a lot of how Randy Johnson throws the ball. In fact if you put the two next two eachother it would be hard to tell the motion apart. Johnson has used that motion for around 19 seasons and through 546 starts.
I don't think there are major flaws in the motion itself. He has a bit of a stiff leg but thats about all that I can see.
by VtTigers on Feb 18, 2007 12:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The problem with that motion
by NYYLover1000 on Feb 18, 2007 1:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
lol
by jpahk on Feb 18, 2007 9:11 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
man, who cares?
by gbrown on Feb 18, 2007 1:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
okay
i will say that personally, i'm not a huge stickler for 100% newspaper-publishable linguistic correctness. (case in point, i don't even capitalize.) but when there are 4-5 mistakes per sentence, it makes it awfully hard to read and understand what somebody is saying. also you get the nagging feeling that you're attempting to discuss the finer points of minor league prospects with a very young child. that's always a disconcerting thought.
by jpahk on Feb 18, 2007 9:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Miller>>Linecum>>Price
by Bondomania on Feb 18, 2007 1:01 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Miller
I can see how some might not like his delivery (it is side-arm and a little whippy...it really looks like a shorter Randy Johnson out there), but you can't argue with the stuff. I think Miller will have the best career of last year's drafted pitchers.
by limozeen on Feb 18, 2007 3:01 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Price...
I think his slider can equal Miller's with a little consistency, that pitch is sick when it's on. He's got a way better changeup now also.
The best thing about Price vs. Miller is that Price destroys Miller mechanically. I'm not a big fan of Miller's stiff leg, cross body thing.
by SenorGato88 on Feb 18, 2007 12:16 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Slider?
In one of Miller's MLB games, I saw him hit a righthanded batter with a slider that started outside. And the batter had no idea it was coming. Miller gets absolutely crazy ping-pong spin on his slider, and given normal development he will dominate with it.
by limozeen on Feb 18, 2007 1:23 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This just isn't true...
by templeUsox on Feb 18, 2007 5:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
wow
I saw Miller pitching in his element in the CWS and he was hitting the glove with both the fastball and the slider. I had no doubt then that Miller had the stuff to be a dominant starter...I was pretty damn pissed that he fell to a division rival in the draft. He looked incredibly nervous in his big league stint, but spring training reports peg him as having a marked improvement in control.
by limozeen on Feb 18, 2007 9:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You have...
by templeUsox on Feb 18, 2007 10:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
why?
If An.Miller is in the majors he "could" have the best slider in the majors and someone else "could" have the best slider in the minors.
having said this i have no clue, lol.
by pedrophile on Feb 19, 2007 12:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i absolutely love Price
but i'll put money down now and a sig bet that says Millers Slider is superior.
it's Unit-like from what i saw and is the main reason why he's compared to him.
by High Heater on Feb 18, 2007 5:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I guess a lot of you...
by templeUsox on Feb 18, 2007 6:10 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
by slurve on Feb 18, 2007 6:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
question
by pedrophile on Feb 18, 2007 6:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Haha
by slurve on Feb 18, 2007 7:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Miller
by MHD on Feb 18, 2007 3:55 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Hmmm....
I've finally found a concrete reason to start dis-liking Timmy!!!
by slurve on Feb 18, 2007 4:19 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
not sure
by realityconquest on Feb 19, 2007 12:30 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
because
i've got to say, i hate the yankees, but i got love for you nyylover1000. forget about the haters.
by D O on Feb 19, 2007 3:34 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not quite
Myself, I could care less about grammar/punctuation, but some of the stuff he posts is completely unintelligible. Mistakes happen, but man can butcher something to the point where you just have no idea of what he is trying to say. Myself, I'll just ignore it and move on, others get frustrated about him cleaning up to where it is at least readable for discussion and poke at him for it.
by slurve on Feb 19, 2007 12:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You're just a bitter chicago fan who hates NY Fans
by NYYLover1000 on Feb 19, 2007 1:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I believe the Bears thing did blow up...
Furthermore, I HATE the Bears, but the Super Bowl did NOTHING to "prove" the Bears D was overrated.
Also, ludacris is not ignoring the poor job of the bear D. Ludacris is a rapper.
And do Cubs fans who blame Steve Bartman really do so believing it wasn't his fault? Because I thought they DID think it was his fault. (Also, I do love the idea that there is a singular Cubs fan who thinks it's Bartman's fault though -- and that guy, you've just discovered, is slurve.)
by bleedjaxblue on Feb 19, 2007 1:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Alright
by NYYLover1000 on Feb 19, 2007 1:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
oh I forgot,
by NYYLover1000 on Feb 19, 2007 1:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
oh? is that a fact?
But, on the off-chance that that's merely a supposition, I will make a few counter-arguments.
1) Why would the Colts have scored 40 if it hadn't been raining? Let me make the counter-argument that the Colts might have scored FEWER points if it hadn't been raining.
For example, did you consider that maybe the rain effected BOTH offenses? Maybe, if it weren't raining, the Bears might have possessed the ball a little longer, and Grossman wouldn't have had so many turnovers.
Maybe, if the score were closer, the Colts would have had to try to force more on offense, and come up short.
Maybe, if the Bears defense weren't on the field so much, they would have been more dominant for the time they WERE there.
If you give the Bears the ball for longer in the game, take away the stupid turnovers, and don't allow the Colts to chip away at the Bears, the score would be totally different.
Meanwhile, it's not like the Colts offense was hindered THAT much by the rain. Prove to me that THEY were, and the Bears weren't.
2) Even if the Colts had scored 40 (which would have been 33 DEFENSIVE points surrendered), it still would have been one game. It also would have been 5 fewer points than the Pats gave up to that same Colts juggernaut two weeks before.
by bleedjaxblue on Feb 19, 2007 4:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
are we really....
To begin with, I think you mean the Bears gave up 26 points per game IN the playoffs, because, "going into the playoffs," they gave up 15.9 points per game.
So why did they give up more in the playoffs? One, they were somewhat banged up. In case you didn't notice, they gave up more points in the last four games of the regular season as well than they had generally been giving up. Was this because "these were big games, and they couldn't step up"? St. Louis, TB, Detroit and Green Bay -- after you've all but clinched the top seed -- hardly seem like games you have to prove anything, so I don't think your theory holds much weight there.
Second of all, it's the playoffs. Do you know the thing that makes the playoffs different than the regular season? You're only playing really good teams. Most of them have really good offenses. You know what happens when a really good defense plays a really good offense? It gives up a few more points than when it plays a really bad offense. Rocket science, right?
You want to know what does NOT make the playoffs different than the regular season? Giving up points/yards in any game doesn't "prove" anything special. You can make a statement, "Great defenses DO NOT give up nearly 200 yards on the ground in the biggest game of the year," but I have no reason to believe that's proof of anything. They don't? Because I swear the Bears defense DID nearly give up 200 yards on the ground, and I'm pretty sure they're a good defense. Why do I say they're a great defense? Because of the other 18 games they played, averaged out. Besides, is there something special about rushing yards? Is 200 yards on the ground a benchmark, like 500 homeruns is to the Hall of Fame, in that, once you give it up, you are NOT a great defense, by definition? That's just garbage.
Besides, I don't know how many times people have to emphasize this to you, but what the Bears were capable of doing to Indianopolis was HARDLY a poor performance. If you told me that this generation's greatest offense was going to have the ball TWICE AS LONG as your team, and that, despite that, you were only going to give up 22 points, I would say that's a pretty impressive effort. I remember you tried to use the Colts success on third-down conversions before as a reason why the Bears D was subpar before, but that's absurd. The Colts were 50% on the year on 3rd-and-10-or-longer, and you want to tell me the Bears got "destroyed" because the Colts were 8-for-18 on 3rd downs of ANY length?
Yes, the Bears are vulnerable to the run up the middle. I've watched it all year. All in all, it hasn't been a fatal flaw by any stretch of the imagination, or did you forget that they won 15 games this year? Did the Bears D have a bad game when Frank Gore had over 10-yards-a-carry against them? I watched the game, and I can assure you: The 49ers were completely helpless that game.
If you want to pick a few games that the Bears didn't COMPLETELY shut down the opposition, I suppose that's your right. But I want to know who you WOULD consider a great defense -- or a great ANYTHING -- because everyone I know about has off-days. Is Albert Pujols overrated because he hit .200 in the World Series? I didn't think so. How about New England's D -- the only defense that gave up fewer points than the Bears during the regular season? They gave up 38 f-ing points to the Colts, despite having roughly even T.O.P. in the Championship game.
So, please, clarify how the Bears have been PROVEN overrated?
by bleedjaxblue on Feb 19, 2007 1:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Bartman
by slurve on Feb 19, 2007 1:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
no intention to say you did....
by bleedjaxblue on Feb 19, 2007 2:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You're soooo busted
I seem to remember you saying a bunch of crap pre-NFC championship... I predicted the Bears to win and even gave some specifics in that Benson would be used to pound the ball (24 carries), that the "over-rated" D would account for 2-3 turnovers and the Saints, being a dome team, would play poorly outdoors in Chicago's January weather. Can you say 3-for-3? You disagreed saying something to the effect that the sAints had one of the best offenses in football and some jiberish about how they were a team of destiny because of Katrina. Puke.
Well, that "over-rated" defense held that highly touted offensive juggernaut pretty much in check. Duece/Bush held to under 40 yards combined rushing and more importantly 14 points. NYYL's response... crickets. Crickets until Grossman cost them the game and then you ran for your PC as fast as you could, probably wetting yourself in the process, to dump on the Bears and toot your own horn. I don't care if the 85 Bears D played in that game, they would have not been able to overcome SIX turnovers by Grossman.
The Bears D lost a few MAJOR players this year, yet they produced the most turnovers/points off turnovers in the NFL this year. Over-rated. Pfff. You wanna call something over-rated, look no farther than your own city. Hello Eli.
by slurve on Feb 19, 2007 1:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
what on Earth....
Didn't he just CLOBBER you with evidence?
And you're saying "bye-bye"?
Why -- did you black out because it hit you so hard?
by bleedjaxblue on Feb 19, 2007 2:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I wonder
by The Congo Hammer on Feb 18, 2007 9:42 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Hey, we're all wrong at some point
by Yoda on Feb 19, 2007 8:01 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I dropped him off my keeper team...
by mraver on Feb 19, 2007 1:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree Congo....
FWIW, I have not seen Price pitch in person, so I will not comment. But from everything I have read, despite being 2 very different pitchers, they may very well have similar amounts of success in the majors.
by guru4u on Feb 19, 2007 2:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Two Good Pitchers, but...
Right now he could win 12-15 games at the MLB level with 150+K's and a sub 4.3 ERA, which is more than the majority of teams have as their #2 in their rotations.
Price hasn't shown the consistancy to even be projected at the MLB level yet. He has the tools, AWESOME tools, but he's still an unknown.
That said, I think Price will be the #1 pick in the draft next year. However, until he pitches a game of pro ball he isn't in the same class as Miller, who has shown the ability to make a MLB rotation.
Also, Price's slider may be even better than Miller's if he can consistantly control it. Price's slider is like Liraino's while Miller's is a more sweeping like Johnson's.
by Sage Sam on Feb 19, 2007 1:06 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I've heard
Nothing against Miller but I'm not sold on him. I think he has great stuff but I'm not sure if I think he'll have good enough command and control...just an opinion but I'll admit I haven't seen enough of either of them to make a really informed one...
by Dfarth on Feb 20, 2007 1:19 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

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