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Barry Bonds Indicted For Perjury, Obstruction

Wow.

http://www.sfgate.com/flat/archive/2007/11/15/news/archive/2007/11/15/state/n141013S18.html

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                     

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Just made it a breaking news about it. He avoided it for as long as he could, I wonder what MLB is going to do about all this now, and what will occur for the records

by T for Jose Tabatha on Nov 15, 2007 5:36 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Knowing MLB
Probably nothing........

by goalieguy on Nov 15, 2007 5:38 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

YEEEESSSSS!!!!
You realize that prospect lists have a time horizon of like 5-10 years, not 5-10 days, right?

by slurve on Nov 15, 2007 5:36 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Sad State of Affairs
The all-time hit king and the all-time homerun king are both going to end up banned for life.
Lex clavatoris designati rescindenda est.

by HuskerBob on Nov 15, 2007 5:36 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

It is sad
but you have to admit - both deserve it.
You realize that prospect lists have a time horizon of like 5-10 years, not 5-10 days, right?

by slurve on Nov 15, 2007 5:39 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

very sad.
I'm actually a fan of him...

by Metty5 on Nov 15, 2007 5:43 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Should that read
was a fan of him?
You realize that prospect lists have a time horizon of like 5-10 years, not 5-10 days, right?

by slurve on Nov 15, 2007 5:45 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Nope.
Honestly if Grimsley and Paul Byrd did it then imo everyone to a degree is doing it.

Maybe his stats are tainted but imo the era is tainted. Since 1994.

by Metty5 on Nov 15, 2007 6:31 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Whoa!
Paul Byrd got a pass I thought?

I agree the era is tainted, but this needed to happen.  Bonds HAS to go down.

You realize that prospect lists have a time horizon of like 5-10 years, not 5-10 days, right?

by slurve on Nov 15, 2007 6:33 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Yea he did
But even after injury he still is gunning it in there at a cool 82 MPH.

Maybe that means that HGH doesn't effect you as much as people think. Maybe it helps hitters more than pitches, I think thats true, but the era is tainted.

Bonds, even with all this jazz is a top 5 all around player all time. His career is legendary and lets not throw all these PED problems on him. it was everyone.    My pessimism meter grows everyday with this stuff. We are living in an innocent until proven guilty system, but society has already found everyone guilty. As far as I'm concerned until the Mitchell report Jeter, Wright, Papi, Holliday and everyone else are guilty too.

Its just sad my thought pattern has gotten to that point.

by Metty5 on Nov 15, 2007 6:40 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Not sure
Unless the eventual case involvs allegations of steroid use, I'm not sure a perjury conviction would be enough to ban Barry.

by Yakker on Nov 15, 2007 5:48 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Isn't that the gist
of the whole case, that he lied about PED's?
You realize that prospect lists have a time horizon of like 5-10 years, not 5-10 days, right?

by slurve on Nov 15, 2007 5:58 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah
You're right.

Just read the indictment (which, BTW, makes it sound an awful lot like Anderson has finally flipped).

So, in order to convict, the government would presumably first need to prove that he knowingly took steroids from Anderson.

by Yakker on Nov 15, 2007 6:37 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Coincidentally
Anderson was released from prison today.
God rested one day out of 7, Felix rests 4 out of 5.

by CrimsonLiederhosen on Nov 16, 2007 1:38 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

And there was much rejoicing
Sad that we are mostly all happy about this, but he and baseball need a bucket of cold water in the face.

by AucklandGM on Nov 15, 2007 5:47 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

hahaha
didnt everyone see this one coming?

it was as obvious as k-fed's retirement plan

by daveh33 on Nov 15, 2007 6:21 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Amazing
At least the Feds waited until after game 4!

by Metty5 on Nov 15, 2007 6:31 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I have to say but we have to root for A-Rod
If he is not on the Mitchell report(I pray he's not on it) we should be happy if he breaks Bonds record.

by Bravesin07 on Nov 15, 2007 6:38 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I don't think
it matters anymore braves - anyone playing now carries a stigma because of dickbags like Bonds.
You realize that prospect lists have a time horizon of like 5-10 years, not 5-10 days, right?

by slurve on Nov 15, 2007 6:40 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

A little trip
down memory lane...

What do all of the Bonds apologists have to say now?

http://www.minorleagueball.com/story/2007/8/8/19132/17335

You realize that prospect lists have a time horizon of like 5-10 years, not 5-10 days, right?

by slurve on Nov 15, 2007 6:42 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

bonds apologists
why would they change their tune now? the indictment certainly doesn't change anything.

by jpahk on Nov 15, 2007 10:20 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

and perhaps by "they"
i mean "we." i'm generally pro-bonds, although i haven't been particularly outspoken about it in this forum.

by jpahk on Nov 15, 2007 10:20 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Change
I guess the people I am looking at when I say that are the ones who were in complete and utter denial that he was using.  The ones that were all "show me one positive test" and were unable to realize that his freakish growth and production spike after age 36 were overt tell-tales, etc.  If you want to support that guy knowing he was a user, that's your gig.
You realize that prospect lists have a time horizon of like 5-10 years, not 5-10 days, right?

by slurve on Nov 16, 2007 6:46 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

i know
i just don't think the indictment counts as any kind of positive test. even setting aside that it's a criminal proceeding rather than a baseball thing, indictment is not the same as conviction. (also, this is one of the shadiest grand juries of all time, so this particular indictment may mean less than most.)

by jpahk on Nov 16, 2007 11:50 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I agree
but if he is convicted - it will be because he used and they were able to prove he lied about it.  Even if he isn't convicted, you have your head in the sand thinking he never used and thinking that's the same as not actually testing positive.
You realize that prospect lists have a time horizon of like 5-10 years, not 5-10 days, right?

by slurve on Nov 16, 2007 11:55 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Pete
and Barry would not be the same case though.  

What Pete did was not legal (betting while not in Nevada or Atlantic City at the time).  It was also specifically prohibitted by major league baseball existing rules at the time he acted (the key fact he is not in the Hall, not the illegal part).

What Barry did was illegal (if steroids) as it was an illegal substance if not taken using a perscription.  However, it was not specifically prohibitted by major league baseball at the time.  This is why Rafael Palmeiro probably won't get in, he did it after it was specifically prohibitted.  I think Barry still gets in, even if he is convicted.

All that being said, I kind of hope Barry will not get in to the Hall. I think his entire career is tainted if he is found guilty.  He might have reached 500(probably).  But are there around 250 questionable home runs? You could pretty easily look at the stats and say yes.  Sure he could have hit them anyway, but that's the crux of the question.  Was he great early in his career.  Yep.  So were a lot of other people that are not in the Hall due to injury plagued/shortened careers.

And I am not saying Pete should not be in the Hall of Fame.  I am actually undecided now.  Used to think he should be in based on his performance on the field.  More and more I am turning to, "You know what, why reward people that are being bastards off the field?"  Future bastards should know that the possibility they don't get accolades DOES ride on the fact your a bastard.  Maybe then we would have fewer bastards in sport. Or at least out of the closet ones.  If you want to be an in the closet bastard, ok with me, just don't parade it.  Maybe more teams will let those kinds of guys just drift off to become drug dealers or the dregs of society who eventually get what's coming to them because they know 'fans' don't really care about only the 'best' athletes playing for their team.

No offense meant to people that were born out of wedlock as the term bastard here is meant to imply a person that does not act in a manner generally moral and nice as compared to the rest of civilized society (is that politically correct for you knee-jerkers?).  Most times I have ever used that term in a couple of paragraphs, that felt kind of fun.

by roaddog on Nov 15, 2007 6:43 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Ehh...
I believe the timeline overlaps after they became illegal - both legally and by the league rules.  He's f#$ked.  No HOF for Barry.
You realize that prospect lists have a time horizon of like 5-10 years, not 5-10 days, right?

by slurve on Nov 15, 2007 6:47 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Bonds before steroids
I think his entire career is tainted if he is found guilty.  He might have reached 500(probably).  But are there around 250 questionable home runs? You could pretty easily look at the stats and say yes.  Sure he could have hit them anyway, but that's the crux of the question.  Was he great early in his career.  Yep.  So were a lot of other people that are not in the Hall due to injury plagued/shortened careers.
This is just way off.  If Bonds had retired after 1999, his stats would be:

14 seasons played, .288 BA, .409 OBP, .559 SLG, 445 HR, 460 SB
Three MVPs, eight Gold Gloves, eight-time All-Star

That is absolutely more than sufficient for the HOF.  It would still be one of the greatest careers of all time.

and boom goes the dynamite.

by Mean Dean on Nov 15, 2007 7:27 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Bonds is going to boycott the hall anyways
might as well not vote him in if he doesn't show up.  

by Bravesin07 on Nov 15, 2007 6:44 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Looks like
it may be a mutual boycott.
You realize that prospect lists have a time horizon of like 5-10 years, not 5-10 days, right?

by slurve on Nov 16, 2007 6:47 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Comment
I've got only one thing to say.

********************************** ********************************** **********************************

It will read something lame like * In 2008 Bonds was convicted of doing what everyone in MLB had been doing for quite awhile.

Bond's crime... he perfected the use of performance enhancing drugs. He was so vastly superior to all the other dirty drug users that it embarassed all of baseball.

What's really amazing is that Barry was one of the best players in Baseball when everyone else was dirty. A Dirty Barry was the best player of all time and it wasn't particulary close.

*****************

He's still undoubtedly a HOF player and still one of the top 10 Players of all time.

All this coming from a Rockies fan. I've got a lot of respect for the player known as Barry Bonds. Our whole team was hopped up on roids in the 90's. Everyone's teams were.

One final thought. Nobody in this country is free to lie except for Presidents and powerful people in positions of unbelieveable power.

by RMF on Nov 15, 2007 9:11 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

did anybody else read the linked article?
i enjoyed this paragraph:
Bonds' physical growth was accompanied by a remarkable power surge. During the 2001 season he broke Mark McGwire's single-season home run crown, and by 2006, he'd passed Babe Ruth to move into second-place among the sport's most prolific power hitters. He will soon in all likelihood surpass Aaron's career mark of 755 homers.

where the hell was paul elias of the associated press this season? living with his head under a rock, in a cave, on mars? somebody should let him know that bonds actually did pass aaron's career mark. or was that whole paragraph copy & pasted from an article a year old?

by jpahk on Nov 15, 2007 10:19 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Bonds
*
Jay Bruce can DISAPPEAR

by ufoboy90 on Nov 15, 2007 10:29 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

I love
the "" because it pisses off the Bonds supporters so much, but I've said before I don't support placing one of those in the record books.  I am open to the idea however of leaving Bonds *out of the record books altogether should this prove beyond a resonable doubt that he juiced/covered it up/tampered/conspired with people to get away with it.
You realize that prospect lists have a time horizon of like 5-10 years, not 5-10 days, right?

by slurve on Nov 16, 2007 6:51 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Damnit
was trying to put an asterisk in quotes and bolded half of the post.
You realize that prospect lists have a time horizon of like 5-10 years, not 5-10 days, right?

by slurve on Nov 16, 2007 6:52 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

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