Reds hire Krivsky as GM

by joerote on Feb 8, 2006 4:26 PM EST Comment 21 comments

What do you Twins fans think of him? He was the guy I wanted because he comes from a small market team that's developed a great farm system, which is the model that I think Cincinnati has to follow to become competetive again. Spending $21 million on Eric Milton types is obviously not the right solution. I'm also glad the Beattie rumors were false as I'm not that impressed with his resume.

0 recs | Comment 21 comments

Story-email Email Printer Print

Comments

Big loss for the Twins

This guy was Ryan's right-hand man for 10 years. He's got scouting experience and is a better negotiator than Ryan IMO. It's good to see the new owner give a guy like that a chance. He'll remake the Reds into a good organization, given the opportunity. But be patient. It takes time to develop the scouting, field coordination, and development systems needed to win in a small market. It took Ryan five years before he started getting good talent in both players and coaches at the minor league level, and another five years before those systems produced major league results.

cmathewson

by cmathewson on Feb 8, 2006 4:33 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

I'm willing to be patient

The Reds system hasn't developed any pitching in 20 years. Saw a stat last year that the Reds have had 4 pitchers win 10+ games in any one season that came through the system since 1990. They were Tom Browning (last good pitcher the Reds developed), Jack Armstrong (was an All-Star in 1990 after a great first half, then fell off the face of the earth), Tim Pugh (was like 12-14 one year in the mid-90s and Brett Tomko (won 10-12 years his first couple years in the league. That's a pretty sad look at how the Reds have developed pitchers in the last couple of decades. With Wood and Bailey, at least there a couple of arms to start to build around.

by joerote on Feb 8, 2006 5:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Krivsky

I'm not sure what to think of him, as I have little idea what his role was within the organization.

by Sulla on Feb 8, 2006 4:34 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

As a reds fan..

I'm excited. I was dreading the Beattie rumors. Not impressed with him. I would have gone with Wren, but Krivisky isn't a bad choice IMHO. I'd like to hear John's take on this...

by cincyinco on Feb 8, 2006 6:41 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

leave Atlanta

Wren may not have wanted to leave Atlanta.

by rojosoto on Feb 8, 2006 9:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

True

I meant to say he was "my" preferred choice, from what I know of the GMs. But Wayne isn't a bad selection either IMO.

by cincyinco on Feb 8, 2006 9:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Krivsky

This is a piece of the official Red press release. http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20060208&content_id=1308 625&vkey=pr_cin&fext=.jsp&c_id=cin

"Krivsky brings to the organization 27 years of scouting and player evaluation experience at all levels of development. Since 1985 his duties have included extensive professional scouting.

In addition to his scouting experience, since 1981 Krivsky has been involved in the contract negotiations of Major League players and the preparation and resoluation of salary arbitration cases. He has a 25-year working knowledge of Major League Baseball's rules and provisions of the Basic Agreement."

Wayne Krivsky's Front Office Experience

February 8, 2006-Present -- General Manager Cincinnati Reds

November 1998-February 2006 -- Assistant General Manager, Minnesota Twins

December 1994-November 1998 -- Special Assistant to the GM, Minnesota Twins

November 1980-December 1994 -- Assistant General Manager, Texas Rangers

January 1979-October 1980 -- Assistant Director of Player Development/Scouting, Texas Rangers

January 1977-January 1979 -- Administrative Assistant/Ticket Sales, Texas Rangers

Seems like he is pretty rounded with lots of scouting experience, contract negotiations, etc. Looks like a good move, but I think it will be a slow process.

Blue Jays - '92, '93

by SharpeShooter on Feb 8, 2006 7:23 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

With any luck...

Krivsky will trade Kearns to the Twins for Lohse...somebody, on the Twins, must love Lohse why else would he still be on the team.

Come on Krivsky, be that guy!

by scarfo on Feb 8, 2006 10:43 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Good god no..

if you want to talk about "luck" then with any luck the twins will trade liriano for kearns.. :P I hope Kriv doesn't take a guy like Lohse off your hands.. we have enough cruddy pitchers..

by cincyinco on Feb 9, 2006 3:26 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

PASS

Lohse is a least a competent pitcher. Kearns has yet to prove he can be a competent hitter.

by Justin & Joe on Feb 9, 2006 8:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Competent......

Maybe you were looking for the word continent when finding an adjective to descibe Lohse. Because he doesn't seem to have any bowel or bladder problems. He does however have problems missing bats and throwing strikes.

by Terry Ryan Jr on Feb 9, 2006 11:08 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Lohse

He's competent, by most measures. He has given the Twins 180-200 innings four consecutive years with a middling ERA. That is the very definition of a competent fourth or fifth starter.

And he still has upside. What I saw from him in the second half last year suggests to me that he could put up a John Garland 2005 type performance with enough run support and better defense at second base. He had a really bad first couple of months last year. But after being taken out of the rotation, reworking his mechanics, and being put back in the rotation, he gave the Twins 14 quality starts in 18 starts with an ERA well south of 4. Project that over a full season of starts and you get what Garland gave the White Sox last year. There aren't a lot of GMs who would pass on that kind of pitcher at $3.5 million.

That said, if Liriano can tighten the control of his fastball, and Baker can keep doing what he is doing, they both are better than Lohse, even projecting the above best case. So Ryan will likely take bids on Lohse near the trade deadline if he can get a good hitter in return. I don't know if that hitter is Kearns, but supposing Stewart continues to slide, Kearns might be a nice option midseason. It would stack the middle of the order at the expense of the top, but the Twins could do worse. If I'm Wayne with my dearth of quality arms, I take that deal in a heartbeat.

My guess is Ryan would rather have a third baseman than an outfielder, especially with Kubel emerging. But he could probably find a fit for Kearns somewhere.

cmathewson

by cmathewson on Feb 9, 2006 11:43 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Krivsky

Well, if Krivsky's been at the front of the Twins arbitration fights, he might not be a huge fan of Lohse, since Lohse is the one guy they've consistently gone to the arbitrator with (and lost). The Twins like to settle before it gets that far, and they've never done that with Lohse.

(As an aside RE: trasding Lohse, let's forget flawed known commodities like Kearns and Lohse, shall we? How about Scott Baker for Edwin Encarnacion?)

I like the Krivsky hire. It's way too early to judge how he'll do, of course. He comes from a "small market" team that's often cited as a model franchise. He comes from a team that knows how to produce young pitching. He supposedly has some foresight/imagination in his player evaluations; for example, he's reportedly the guy who was most vocal about getting the Joe Nathan trade done because he was convinced Nathan could be a dominant closer. That's a huge gift for a team like the Reds, because the alternative to imagination/foresight is signing guys like Eric Milton.

by jianfu on Feb 9, 2006 10:30 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Nathan, Liriano, and Boof

The trade was AJ Pierzynski for Nathan, Liriano, and Boof Bonser. I would guess we'd see more of those types of trades than a prospect-for-prospect swap.

by rojosoto on Feb 9, 2006 1:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Baker for Encarnacion!

If I'm Terry Ryan, I love this deal. His stated concern with moving Lohse is the lack of experience and knowledge of major league hitters on the part of Baker and Liriano. He just doesn't want two rookies in his rotation, at least not until one of them gets a half season of work under his belt at the big league level. Well, if he traded Baker instead of Lohse, that probelm would disappear. Liriano would become the #5 starter and Ency would push T-bat out the door.

cmathewson

by cmathewson on Feb 9, 2006 2:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

The numbers guy....

From what I read in the Star Tribune it looked as if Krivsky was the central force when it came to re-upping deals within the organization. He was/is responsible to locking up Johan, Hunter, etc. Now as a Twins fan this has been mostly a bad thing. As the Twins have not been able to pick out a fluke career year from an upward trend. The Joe Mays, Torii Hunter, and Shannon Stewart contracts are evidence of this. Now he must have had others working with him in the Twins career year "$50,000 Jackpot Wad" contract negotiations scheme, but that might be something to look forward to in Cincy.

by Terry Ryan Jr on Feb 9, 2006 11:06 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Loshe

Why throw this guy under the bus?

He pitches a 180 innings a year at league average. He keeps the team in games. And he's affordable and fairly young, with the possibility of at least improving.

Jeez the Yankees and Red Sox pay about 10 million per for that type of performance without the fancy name.

As the Reds it doesn't matter what Krivsky can or cannot do; it depends on what the new owner allows them to spend in the draft. The last 4 years have been a travesty of justice as the Reds let prospect after prospect go for signability picks because the purse strings were being held so tight. Hopefully the new guy spends 4-5 million more a year here rather than throwing money at the likes of Milton or Wilson (or Tony Womack for god's sake).

"Strikeouts are good...groundballs are better. Home runs are okay...but walks SUCK!" Mike Caldwell

by Torncuff on Feb 10, 2006 9:34 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Yankees yes, Boston no

The yankees have several mediocre pitchers making in the $10 M range (Pavano and Wright being the most notable).

The only Sox pitchers much over $4 M are Schilling and Clement @$6.5M. I am not a huge Clement fan but I think he is clearly better than Lohse. Other than Schilling, the Sox 6 potential SP average less than $4M/year. All of whom are better than Lohse.

by cdamon on Feb 10, 2006 2:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

He gets thrown under the bus because.....

Lets say that you have 6 stones in front of you. 2 Diamonds, 1 ruby, 2 emeralds, and a lump of coal. You get to keep 5 of the six. The lump of coal has value. It might keep you warm, it certainly serves a purpose. But, if you have to give up one of the other stones for it you would be a fool. That's the way I look at the Twins rotation and Lohse. He is a lump of coal. Valuable, but not worth using in rotation that could have 5 gems.

I am really in the camp that he could be magnificent in a long-relief/emergency starter role. If you take what he already has and give him the 2-4 mph bump in velocity that most relievers get I think that he could be a championship quality player. Minnesota will not pay him for that role, but in that role he might be worth it.

by Terry Ryan Jr on Feb 10, 2006 4:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

That's fair, but....

all those pitchers making so much less than 4 million last year (Wells, over 4, Wakefield, over 4.5, Arroyo, only 1.5 agreed) made either twice as much or close to what Lohse made last year.

Not Beckett of course, who wasn't pitching in Boston, but I certainly would agree was/is/will always be better than Lohse.

Wells 15-7 4.56 ERA 1.31 WHIP 190 IP 220
Wakefield 16-12 4.15 ERA 1.23 WHIP IP 225
Arroyo 14-10 4.51 ERA 1.30 WHIP IP 205

Lohse 9-13 4.10 ERA 1.41 WHIP IP 179

My contention is not that Lohse is good. It's that he has doesn't suck and has some usefulness. Certainly not as much of Expected Value as Beckett, Schilling, Wakfield. But it's not like you cut him and get nothing in return.

Finally, KYLE LOHSE IS NOT GOOD. BUT HE DOESN'T SUCK. HE JUST IS. Could he be more? Sure, but we all could. But a 200 IP/4.00 ERA pitcher less than 30 years old in the major leagues, is useful.

"Strikeouts are good...groundballs are better. Home runs are okay...but walks SUCK!" Mike Caldwell

by Torncuff on Feb 10, 2006 3:22 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

actually agree

with most of what you are saying. Lohse is a typical #4/#5 starter and paid accordingly.

I just had to take objection to the Sox $10M pitcher crack. Despite the obvious competition, the Sox and Yankees are not in the same ballpark payroll wise.

by cdamon on Feb 10, 2006 8:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs