thoughts on joey gathright...

by rhodehead on Nov 15, 2005 6:59 PM EST

Here is a guy alot of people seem to be split on. On one hand, he has awesome speed, probably one of the fastest in the majors. On the other hand, he has no power, definitely a slap hitter. Juan Pierre is the comparison that gets thrown out there the most. Others say he will make an impact because of his speed, but not as a regular...

The Drays OF is crowded as it is and Rocco is coming back. Gathright has been rumored in a number of trades, the latest i believe has him going to the Padres.

What does everyone think about him? Will he get on base enough to make a difference as a regular leadoff hitter in the bigs? Fantasy-wise, can he get enough PT to have an impact with his speed?

Any and all thoughts welcome...

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Trade Bait

A team like the Dodgers could probably use him. He's improved defensively, so I think he's a better defender than Pierre. I think he can be a regular. If he can learn to hit the ball in the gaps and walk like he did in the minors, he could be a valuable player.

by UncleMiltie on Nov 15, 2005 7:17 PM EST reply actions

Gathright

I'm very high on Gathright. Awesome speed. Good OBP in the minors. He's a leadoff hitter so who cares if he has power or not? His job is to get on base, run the bases, and score runs.

by DrBGiantsfan on Nov 15, 2005 8:19 PM EST reply actions

I'm not as sold

When you look at his high OBP in the minors, it's completely batting average dependent. He dosen't have a great amount of plate discipline and he has absolutely no power whatsoever. He never broke even a .400 slugging percentage in the minors, at any level. If his slap-happy approach doesn't carry over into the bigs, and I don't think it will, he's basically Vince Coleman with less power (see also Chavez, Endy).

Hey Bartender! I think ol' Jobu needs a refill!

by nothinlikethetown on Nov 15, 2005 8:28 PM EST up reply actions

Be skeptical

I agree. A high OBP in the minors for a guy with low power has less odds of translating to MLB than it does for a hitter with respectable or plus power. Most MLB pitchers have enough control that if they aren't concerned with being careful when dealing to a batter they won't issue many free passes to them. There are exceptions to this as Counsell has had a few decent walk seasons... but I always say... don't count on a player being the exception to the rule. Be skeptical, don't invest too heavily and have plan Bs with flawed players.

"If you don't like Torey Lovullo, then you don't like baseball." Sparky Anderson

by natsfan2005 @ Minor League Ball on Nov 15, 2005 10:48 PM EST up reply actions

Plate Discipline?

Gathright's BA with the Durham Bulls was .305, his OBP was .388. Since when is a OBP/BA differential of over .80 BA dependent? That's pretty darn good if you ask me, especially for a leadoff hitter with no power. BTW, lots of people were telling me the same thing about Chone Figgins when I was bragging him up a couple of years ago. BTW, Gathright's SLG% for Durham was .407.

by DrBGiantsfan on Nov 15, 2005 11:07 PM EST up reply actions

Maybe

we have different sources for our stats. Mine say he slugged .373 at Durham.

Hey Bartender! I think ol' Jobu needs a refill!

by nothinlikethetown on Nov 15, 2005 11:17 PM EST up reply actions

Baseball Cube...

...has this line in 2005...

.305/.388/.407

http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/G/joey-gathright.shtml

...and so does BA...

http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/Stats/showp.php?id=431157

Gathright's an interesting player, in that he's not content to just get his quick slap in; indeed, he sees quite a few pitches (3.78/PA in MLB so far). It's easy to bunch him together with a load of other failed CF prospects, but he may be different. That .397 minor league OBP may have been fueled by speed, but who cares how a guy reaches base...just so long as he does. Something akin to it sure would look nice atop any major league lineup.

by Azteca on Nov 15, 2005 11:29 PM EST up reply actions

My fault

I was looking at his '04 Durham stats.

Hey Bartender! I think ol' Jobu needs a refill!

by nothinlikethetown on Nov 15, 2005 11:34 PM EST up reply actions

Gathright

http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/features/040408parkfactors.html

Assuming those are still somewhat right, Gathright's .102 isolated power just isn't going to translate to be much of anything. How many guys go out and hit .300/.400/.350? There's little incentive to pitch around a player if they have no power at all.

I'm no expert, but he looks a little like Willy Taveras to me.

by nygiants5811 on Nov 16, 2005 9:36 AM EST up reply actions

Tavares

Yeah, and to me Tavares is only someone you tolerate when a few players are maxing out your payroll and you absolutely must fill some spots with league minimum players. I absolutely detested seeing that kid try to but for base hits with men on base virtually every time up.

"If you don't like Torey Lovullo, then you don't like baseball." Sparky Anderson

by natsfan2005 @ Minor League Ball on Nov 16, 2005 10:02 AM EST up reply actions

Taveras

Willy Taveras! Is it too late to take back Huston Street's Rookie of the Year award?

- Charlie, Bucs Dugout

by Charlie Wilmoth on Nov 16, 2005 6:56 PM EST up reply actions

Projection

Gathright's BB rate is slightly above average among 24-year-olds.
He K-rate isn't very good, however, so I would judge his overall plate discipline as about "average".

I look at his minor league numbers and see a useful-but-not-great .285/.340/.360 type of hitter at the MLB level.

by FI @ Minor League Ball on Nov 16, 2005 11:42 AM EST up reply actions

Speed

If you factor in his speed/basestealing skills, a .340 OBP would make him an offensive force at the top of most lineups. I think his OBP could be more around .360 though.

by DrBGiantsfan on Nov 17, 2005 12:41 AM EST up reply actions

See Jose Reyes as an example

60 stolen bases and 99 runs scored with a .300 OBP. Mets fans would kill for a .340 OBP from Jose.

Policeman: Sir, are you classified as human? Korben Dallas: Ah, negative. I am a meat popsicle.

by finman on Nov 17, 2005 12:15 PM EST up reply actions

Fun to watch....

But I'd love to deal him for some bullpen help. He looks completely lost vs lefties and his speed makes up for a lot of bad jumps in the OF. Not to mention, his arm is probably only stronger than Damon's.

by UCFKnights on Nov 15, 2005 8:54 PM EST reply actions

Gathright

And how much is he going to play in Tampa now that they've resigned Baldelli? He could play for a while if they DH Huff (which is what they should do) but Delmon should be up soon and then what? I guess they could finally trade Huff and then DH Delmon. But Bankston could get into the mix also, which could put Gathright back on the bench. I just dont see him getting a lot of playing time unless there's an injury.

by rhd on Nov 15, 2005 10:42 PM EST reply actions

A lot depends on....

If Gomes starts in rf or DH. If Huff plays 1b, rf, or DH. If some other DH doesn't suck up at bats. If Tampa stops giving at bats to guys like Hollins, Phelps, and Sanchez (I know that Phelps/Sanchez are not in TB but there are others to take their place). There is room for a #4 outfielder to get 400 PAs.

Or he could get traded to a team that needs a centerfielder.

I think that there is a very good chance that he gets some serious PAs.

by LindInMoskva on Nov 15, 2005 11:12 PM EST reply actions

for example, the yankees?

but i don't see any really probable trade possibilities with them, i was just going with their need for a CF...i do think that a trade is not only likely but its imminent

by Rob Castellano on Nov 16, 2005 12:10 AM EST reply actions

Simply put

There is no way he is one of the D-Rays best 3 outfielders. That isn't even counting Gomes as a DH, and Upton not yet moved to the outfield. Crawford Baldelli and Young will be the D Rays outfield for possibly the next decade.

Rios is the next Juan Gonzales, thats right, I said it.

by KaoticKlown on Nov 16, 2005 1:55 AM EST reply actions

Playing time...

good responses, I pretty much figured the opinions would be split, as much of my research led me to the same split conclusion.

if gathright get the playing time, say even 400 ab's, he might be able to steal 35 bases. In Tampa Bay 2006, he likely will not get 400 ab's unless there is an injury. He did manage to swipe 20 bags in 203 ab's this year, as a part time/platoon guy.

As a fantasy option, i obviously would only be looking for him in the stolen bases and runs categories, of which i think he can contribute nicely (with semi-regular pt) Speed is a valuable commodity...While i don't expect or think he will turn into Juan Pierre, i would hope he can be valuable fantasy weapon...

by rhodehead on Nov 16, 2005 12:09 PM EST reply actions